Why don’t front wheel drive performance cars gain in value?
Why don’t front wheel drive performance cars ever seem to appreciate? Why can you buy an amazing car like the Spirit R/T for $5,000? Why aren’t the rare Omni GLHS and Shelby Daytonas selling for more than their original price tag?
I don’t know why the rear wheel drive cars do so well and the turbocars don’t, but I’d have to agree that part of it is the guys in their 50s. Another part is that so many people either had one of those cars or knew someone who did. There were far fewer cars made (in terms of brands and models), and the hot cars got lots of print and pictures in the magazines. Nobody really drove trucks unless they had to or REALLY were into the truck image; Jeep sales were much smaller than they are now, crossovers and minivans didn’t exist. Almost all the market was in sedans and coupes, with wagons a definite minority. They sold Dusters like Toyota now sells Camrys, only there were fewer people, so market penetration was far higher. And if you had, say, a 318 ‘Cuda, you would want one now to relive those good times - only now if you had the money, you’d get the one you wanted then, the 340, or the Hemi, or whatever. I think that’s what gets the prices up.
Look at the turbocars and you find they were often either not big sellers, or were unique. The Daytona never sold as well as any A-body. Though it clearly outsold some cars - Superbird/Charger Daytona, whose rarity is also a factor in their cost now - Superbird and Charger Daytona were basically Belvederes and Chargers, and THOSE were in a huge number of families (and for that matter the Charger was a sporty Coronet, which was also a huge seller).
Look at what’s selling for big bucks. B-bodies - the most popular cars Chrysler sold! The big sellers are the cars we grew up in, or owned, but with the performance goodies. A-bodies - ditto. That’s something like a quarter of the market back then in those two lines. Ditto for the Ford and GM lineups. C and D bodies aren’t nearly as popular though they are far rarer.
What’s more, those cars were what people wanted at the time; nobody disparaged the idea of American-made rear wheel drive V8 or even straight-six sedans and coupes. IT WAS WHAT EVERYONE HAD. Imports counted for nearly nothing; even Volkswagen was a niche player in the day, and Toyota was practically invisible until the 1970s.
Now, let’s look at the turbocars. They were made at a time when the imports had already taken over the mind of the American market; American carmakers bragged about their European feel and Japanese-like quality. The big performance front-drivers in the Mopar world were basically the turbo Daytona, Omni GLHS, and Spirit R/T. Spirit R/T might be worth something someday but nobody knew what it was then, and people won’t be seeking it unless they happen to come to Allpar; and by then darned few will be left functional. Yes, those might appreciate, but they’re still sinking because their reliability is, well, not always there, parts are hard to find, and they offer far less performance (if you include turns!) than a Neon SRT-4. Spirit R/T and Daytona R/T are, I think, most likely to gain in value: rarity plus speed that still beats most performance cars. Omni GLHS is also almost a secret, and that might be worth something though it’s a punishing car to drive, from what I’ve heard; Omni sold BIG for a few years. Daytonas didn’t sell all that well compared to, say, A or B bodies as a whole; or Dusters, but they offer good comfort and performance. I’d like one myself if my garage was empty. I’m starting to convince myself they’ll go up in value except for one thing: they were made when American cars were undesirable among a large segment of the population, and after fashion trends had changed.
Even now, there’s a snobbery of the rear wheel drivers - as though any rear wheel drive car can beat a front wheel drive car. At the time of the turbocars, Chrysler even published a chapter on why the front wheel drive cars could easily outhandle the rear drivers; which is pretty true until you get to a certain power level. But it’s Generally Accepted ™ that rear wheel drive is needed by any serious sports car. That’s one strike.
The perceived superiority of Japanese and German cars at the time the front-drive performance cars were made is another strike … the muscle cars were made before the Japanese, in particular, changed the model for cars. Detroit was clearly dominant then; it was weakened and on its present course by the time front wheel drive took over. I think that’s a factor.
The fact that the muscle cars offer a certain level of brute force - instant kick - that the turbocars generally don’t have is a third strike. They might not be as fast - a 340 Duster might not be able to beat a Daytona Turbo IV - but they have a certain kick which comes partly from the firmer shifting of the automatics most are equipped with, and partly from the torque-heavy tuning of the engines. I think that makes them more desirable, as well.
There’s also rarity on the street. I rarely see a car made before 1980. I see cars that look like front-drive performance Mopars all the time. The old fashioned look is hard to find; if you get a Daytona, you get a car that looks as though it could be in production right now. If you get a Valiant, Duster, Road Runner, etc., it’s clearly classic.
As for the gap between two door and four door, I can’t explain it!
Update: if I may quote “VNT” from the forums… mildly edited for the change of venue…
The 1986 Omni GLHS cars which are clean are in high demand, but the sales are not as public, and there aren’t many of them since so few were made. The 1986 GLHS made Hemmings’ list of the top 10 collectables of the 1980s cars. A clean mint example would sell in the $10-15K range. The 1989 CSX VNT cars are also valued. One thing which does hinder them is there is no Year One to call up and get repo parts; try finding mouldings, window felts, etc.
Actually, many of the front wheel drive performance cars are increasing in value, such as the Laser XT, the IROC R/T, and the CSX-VNT. I personally saw one low mileage showroom condition IROC R/T on sale for $18,000. However, as VNT alluded to, only the ones in very good to excellent condition will appreciate in value. The problem with the 80’s performance cars is a complete lack of aftermarket support. I went to the SDAC-17 (Shelby Dodge) car show in PA a few weeks ago. I saw a lot of great looking Shelby Chargers, Daytonas, and Omni GLH’s. Unfortunately, what many of them also had in common were torn, ripped seats, disentegrated weatherstripping, and destroyed door panels. Without access to any new replacement parts, these cars can only be restored up to a certain level. And that is going to affect their desireability.
The only 60’s muscle cars that are selling for enormous money are the meticulously restored vehicles. Rustbucket Cudas and Swiss-cheese Chargers are not selling for $250,000. Of course, it is easy to restore a 68 Charger, or a 69 Road Runner, when you can buy practically every part brand new from Year One, or a dozen other vendors. Without a Year One for the 80’s muscle cars, the only 80’s Mopars that are going to go for huge money are low mileage originals, and how many of those are we going to find? Nobody is going to buy an 89 Daytona with 200,000 miles on the odometer, and a broken windshield that is impossible to replace, for any amount of money.
I predict that once the aftermarket stops ignoring these cars, and allows the fans to completely restore these cars to showroom condition, you will see their values shoot up tremendously.
One of the best cars I ever drove was a Shadow ES Turbo with VNT. That had to be a 1988 or so? That car was lightning quick.
“response to number 1 post”
A few months ago I spoke to a neighbor who has a pretty old mustang ( prolly around 67) and a 70s thunderbird. He said he preferred mopars but the pieces are so hard to find/expensive to buy that it’s simply not worth it to own one. Any decent looking Cuda or Challenger sell for a LOT. its not the same with GM or Ford vehicles.
70s Mopars pieces are very hard to find, or are very expensive. Thus your argument, while being valid, has a limit.
I’d say its because the 60s were the beginning of the golden age of the muscle cars, while the 70s was the peak of the american cars’ glory. What are the 80s? depressive years: glam rock, tight pants ;). for the most part, ugly and power lacking cars. It’s nothing like the 70s.
ps: I was born in ‘87 so the only 80s moment I remember were the lime green, pink and purple coats that you can buy for 1$ in the salvation army’s shop.
My point is, the cars from the 60s and 70s are valuable because it was the muscle car’s age. the 80s’s mustangs were ugly, so was the corvette and camaro. Its only normal to try to forget those years, and that includes the cars from those years. Just a thought.
I basically scanned the article - which was well written by Dave, and thought I’d put my two sense worth in.
I’m not exactly sure why fwd performance cars gain in value, but I think I know part of the equation. For the fwd turbo Dodges of the 80s, I can fully understand why people, such as myself, don’t think they will ever become collectable.
1) For one, these cars were built during the “dark ages” of the automobile industry. Power was down; styling was down, blah, blah, blah… I’ve heard it all, but I think people think of this time period as a time in automotive history when nothing was good. It was a low point if you will. I go both ways on this, but I’m not going to explain my opinion on this at the moment. Needless to say, people generally don’t want to relive something they thought sucked 20 years ago.
2) If you go to any GM, Ford, or import board, the Turbo Dodges of the 80s aren’t thought of very well. I guess that is to be expected since they have a love affair with their own car brands. Doesn’t make it right, but I generally find that to be the case.
3) A very good majority of Mopar fans do not respect or think much of the fwd turbo cars of this time period. Why buy a piece of junk Omni GLHS when you can buy a much better, newer, higher quality Neon SRT-4 that blow the tires off the Omni. Even though the Omni was done by Shelby 20 years ago and the one that started things off for the Neon SRT-4, it is pretty much forgotten. Same with the Daytona turbos, Spirit R/Ts… etc. You can get a “Charger” R/T with a V-8 and “right wheel drive” and blow the doors off the Spirit. I mean who wants to put up with fwd and a turbo when you have the legendary “Hemi” and rwd? I remember when I used to read Mopar Action and everything was rwd, rwd, rwd. That is all every Mopar fan wanted. Unfortunately, Chrysler (like usual) didn’t listen. Being that I grew up with the turbo Dodges of the 80s, I looked for any print I could find on them (especially Daytonas). I never really found much and when I did, it was usually an article talking about converting a Daytona into a V-8, rwd car or somebody trying to defend these cars (with little success). No, Mopar Action never talked these cars down, BUT they never really gave them the time of day. The fwd performance cars started taking off in the magazines when the Neon and PT Cruiser came about.
4) The amount of people that know about these cars is pretty low. Other than a few Shelby Dodge clubs or passionate Mopar fans, these cars would be in the recycle bin.
I own a 1989 Daytona Shelby that I hope to restore some day. I’m not expecting it to increase in value or become highly collectible; rather, I just want to enjoy a car from my youth - a car that I dreamed of owning. I figure my 2003 Mustang Mach 1 will be far more collectible in the future, but I’m keeping the Daytona around as a sentimental reminder of when my family used to be involved with Chrysler on the retail level and when I used to respect and admire Chrysler.
There are too many great cars out on the road today to even think about the turbo Dodges. I used to follow them more, but there are just too many tempting products out there for me to really go back to the turbo Dodges of the 80s and 90s. I think society sees that as well. Maybe they’ll be collectible some day; I just don’t see it happening. The current generation of cars is where your next collectibles will come from. I would love to be wrong and see my Daytona be worth something some day, but I’m not holding my breath.
Here are the more popular 80’s vintage cars that I presently and consistently see showing up at local cruise nights and car show here in North Jersey:
1) Ford Mustang
2) Chevrolet Camaro
3) Pontiac Firebird/Trans AM
4) Buick Grand National
5) Chevrolet Monte Carlo SS
6) Olds Cutlass/442
7) Chevrolet Corvette
8) Chrysler LeBaron T&C
9) Pontiac Grand Prix
10) Chevrolet Cavalier Z24
There is a well established market for these cars and some like the Buick GN’s are starting to see big numbers. The Chrysler T&C convertible has a decent following and is probably the most collectible of all the 80’s FWD cars although the Z24, particularly the convertible, seems to be more popular with the younger crowd. I had a Daytona back in the day but my choice in collector cars is V8 RWD. That is the choice for most guys my age. Not that I don’t like the FWD cars but I like the style of the 60’s muscle cars better. The next group of collector cars will come from the 90’s and will include more FWD and now more import name plates. Going into the new century the 2003 Mach 1 is a shoe in. They are popular at shows now as are all of the newer Mustangs, especially the Cobras and Roushes. My predictions for the collectible cars for the 90’s is as follows:
1) Ford Mustang
2) Mazda Miata
3) Chevrolet Corvette
4) Chevrolet Camaro
5) Pontiac Firebird/Trans Am
6) Honda CRX
7) Honda Civic
8) Honda Del Sol
9) Nissan 240 SX
10) Chrysler LeBaron Convertible
Again, this is just my opinion based on what I’m seeing out at cruis nights and car shows. I’m sure there are some I missed.