Fun is in the car, not the stats
Too often, auto forums are filled with criticisms based on armchair racing. If a car is .1 second slower, it’s “far too slow.” Something that actually does zero to sixty in more than eight seconds is unbearably slow. All transmissions need five - no, six - no, seven speeds. What, the minivan doesn’t even have over 200 horsepower?
Let’s stop for a moment.
First, there’s the reason for having all that horsepower - the subjective feel of speed. It’s what makes an SRT-8 so much more exciting than the Lexus that can keep up on the straights. Let’s take a little quote for a moment:
Under the hood is a 4.6 liter V8 that pushes out 381 horsepower accompanied by gobs of torque, which can maintain a dead-silent, smooth idle at 600 rpm. The engine provides good power right off idle, and revs like a demon, but most of the time it isn’t worked particularly hard, because it’s pretty hard to use 380 horsepower for more than a few seconds without hitting an obstacle or going well beyond the speed limit. Sixty miles per hour comes up in little over five seconds, territory not long ago reserved for sports cars. Yet, the drivetrain is rarely anything more than completely refined.
That’s from the acarplace Lexus LS 460 car review. Yes, the Lexus LS460 does 0-60 in 5.4 seconds, and it does it quite easily. To quote more from the same review:
Taking off the rough edges enhances luxury, but it does eliminate much of the “driving enjoyment” that comes of feeling the engine and the road, and revelling in the feel of acceleration. Indeed, the more luxurious the car, the less acceleration is felt, as transitions are smoothed out; so that we’ve known some people with powerful sport sedans to go out in their stick-shift Neons for a quick fun drive, with their vibration, harshness, and slower 0-60 times. A car like the Dodge Charger R/T is considerably slower than the LS, but feels faster as the transmission firmly changes gears and the engine speed picks up in its peak torque range; the LS transmission is rarely felt even under hard acceleration, and the dual variable valve timing, quad cams, and dual fuel injection system keep the engine working hard throughout its range.
Really, a first-generation stick-shift Neon feels just about as fast as a blistering hot LS460. It’s a lot more fun, too, though on a long highway drive or in nasty traffic, the Lexus is far nicer. The fact is, as far as I can tell, refinement is the enemy of speed-sensation. If you want to feel like you’re going fast, don’t get a fast car; get one that isn’t “refined.”
That’s one reason why the Caliber SRT-4 being a little slower than some competitors doesn’t bother me (yet), and that’s one reason why the GTI’s being considerably slower than some competitors (WRX comes to mind) didn’t hurt it in comparison tests. The question isn’t so much “what time does it make” as “how much fun is it?” But, then again, I don’t race. If I did, it would be another story. Racers should indeed try for the fastest speed they can get.
That brings us to another thing - horsepower ratings. Horsepower ratings are but one part of a full story. When Toyota put the Celica engine into the Corolla, they ended up with a car that made great paper numbers and did 0-60 sprints well, but was a dog to drive. All the power was at the top end; fine for racing, I guess, but not very useful day-to-day, when you want massive torque to push you forward the second you ask for it. That’s one reason why the Neon was better to drive than the Caliber, though the Caliber has much more horsepower. The Caliber revs high and gives power way up top. One of the nicest all-round engines I’ve driven was the 2.5 liter turbo - nice torque down low and the turbo kicked in afterwards. It was far more pleasant, if far slower, than the sledgehammer approach of the Spirit R/T, which made over 70 additional horses but had very little right off the line (unless you were prepared and revved up front). Again, great for racing but less than ideal for the street - except perhaps street-racing. There are times when instant takeoff is quite nice.
We can’t really trust the glossy magazines to tell us when a car is well balanced, because most equate “well balanced” with “German.” It’s like asking Consumer Reports to fairly evaluate the Sebring against the Camry. Most glossies are just in love with six-figure cars from Europe, and consider American cars to be something lower than dirt. The exception is, of course, the stereotype cars (big rear-drive V8s) and, sometimes, trucks. And even when they do tell us about peaky engines and such, many people ignore that and go right to the columns of figures.
It IS important to know about sprint times, but let’s be reasonable. Nobody really needs to get from zero to sixty in faster than ten seconds. The extra speed is nice at times, but we can do without it; we did without it for decades. The fabled 300 letter cars often couldn’t beat a 1995 Neon (stick-shift of course), but that doesn’t make them slow. Hey, when I drive my unmodified 1974 Valiant - slant six equipped, with an automatic to make sure it doesn’t get too fast - I’m nearly always the quickest one off the traffic light. It’s pretty rare that I need more than that 100 horsepower (at best), dragging 3,000 pounds of car behind an automatic transmission, fed by a primitive single-barrel carburetor. I do enjoy the much faster pickup of my turbocharged PT, but I don’t NEED it.
Horsepower ratings are also a bit of a misnomer - the PT and SRT-4 made the same horsepower, or at least almost the same horsepower. Yet the SRT-4 was a capable of brutal acceleration and the PT … at least can beat my wife’s 300M if I shift well. We play with horsepower ratings the way people used to play with numbers of cylinders. I still remember having my fanny handed to me in my V8 Camaro, when I was neatly beaten by my girlfriend’s Honda CRX - which got over 30 mpg. Weight matters. Torque matters (well, maybe not in that CRX). Horsepower curves matter. Feel matters.
So don’t be so critical if a minivan does 0-60 in 12 seconds. It really doesn’t need to beat a Honda Odyssey in a race - especially since nearly every buyer is looking for how comfortable, usable, reliable, and economical it is.
Not that I wouldn’t love to see a Caravan R/T with that upcoming turbocharged Phoenix engine and automated manual transmission blowing away the Odysseys by 2 seconds in the quarter mile…
Personally I find 30-60 much more valuable than 0-60. Like you said, I’m rarely involved in stoplight races. However, I regularly merge on to freeways - that’s where I need the performance bias to be.
The thing is Dave, that we are targetted by merchandising, and peak power it´s a greate seller, now also it´s MPG, but that is kinda new.
it´s called Paper racing as you mentioned, and it sells, besides, the more refined a car is, it usually gives better mileage becouse of the restrictions on roll resistance, among other stuff.
Today´s car buyer wants everything Greate mileage, Greate 0-60 or 30-60 times, all the blows and wisles, confortable ride, and a razonable price, is it wrong to want it all? no, espetially if you can get all of this from OTHER BRAND, that´s what we should focus on, being the benchmark again, not just the inventors of this or that vehicle, but the BEST darn vehicle on each category.
“the more refined a car is, it usually gives better mileage becouse of the restrictions on roll resistance, among other stuff.”
The opposite is sometimes true. Sound insulation adds a surprising amount of weight, especially in the forms of heavier window glass; and don’t forget the torque-management in the transmission hurting acceleration.
People look at horsepower the way they used to (and still do) look at computer clock-speeds and hard drive capacities. The latter can be important but more often than not are irrelevant. (Clock speeds in particular, when compared across processors, give little indication of actual ability.)
Disclaimer: Yes I drive a Mazda, but I frequently read these articles because I am a car guy, and I recognized some months ago that the shift in Chrysler is one of those rare moments that could very well alter the course of the industry in America. I found these articles and comments to be a good indication of how the fan community felt about the changes.
I fully agree with your assessment that it isn’t how fast a car is, but how fun it is. I cannot begin to pass on to you how much fun I had as a kid with my 1991 Civic Sedan with a 5 speed transmission, 1.5L 92HP engine, and 4 wheel double wishbone suspension. I wish I had never sold it :) I disagree though that a fun car should have large amounts of torque off the line. I am the opposite, I prefer a “top-heavy” torque curve. To me there is nothing funner than passing with a car like that. Press in the clutch pedal, let the stick slide into a gear or two lower, and let the engine fly. That’s the trick with a top heavy torque curve. As I used to say with my Civic, “in this car, accelerate with the stick shift not with the throttle”.
But other than that tiny detail, I agree with everything else.
I have been preaching the same thing for years. Far too many folks are concerned with the numbers on paper, and far too few seem to be looking at the total package.
My buddy and I came home from a Carlisle trip a few years back - me in my Stratus, him in his Honda S2000 - two very different cars, two very different power levels, but both adept to the tasks at hand. I could leave him from a dead stop every time, but if the race went a longer distance, the screaming 8-9K redline of the S2000 would pass me by. Both cars were able to take the turns of Interstate 68 with grace. But at the end of the trip, there was no “winner” or “loser” - both cars did what was asked of them and did it well. It didn’t matter one bit what the numbers on the paper said.
Reading the mags and websites to get information is fine - but until you put your butt in the seat and drive the car, they don’t mean much by themselves.
As someone whom has owned Dodges all my driving life.
I believe that dealerships should take an active role, In periodic bolt on’s, add on’s to a customer’s vehicle during service intervals!
Having owned an SRT4, knowing I could get performance upgrades under warranty, Kept my experience fresh and exciting, When you own “the new hot car or truck” your experience is fleeting as competitors catch up to it.
Most people favor simple easy changes that have real value to thier owner’s!
For example : Free flowing intakes, & exhaust, appearance products, computer upgrades & performance chips. It has been my experience,
that dealership services, focus great service and care for about 3 years, then try to convince you or suggest Maybe it’s it’s time to trade up, because newer is better! That makes you feel as if, what you own is now inferior, Sure they make more $$ selling new cars, But if your ownership experience is a great one, the first place you go is back to where you got your vehicle.
If you have ever gone with someone to a Toyota dealership for service, They behave as if (You are driving the best product in the world, and it is expected to serve you well for many years)
Perhaps even the possibility of a Dodge/Jeep/Chrysler Club You have a fixed payment, lease or membership, equal to the monthly cost of ownership terms, where you can pick from a choice of a pool of several vehicles.
Say the terms monthly or quarterly, You plan your life by what you do, In the spring, you have projects at home, pick a truck, in the summer you take vacation, perhaps a convertible, or a Jeep. That could be a great customer experience! The return for the dealer would be more than a traditional lease, and the customer would benefit greatly with the flexibility and choice.
I would love to see something like the Rapid Transit System or the Scat Pack from the 60’s make a comeback. I also agree with fun being much more than numbers on paper. I had the time of my life when I rode in a friend’s 1965 Dodge Coronet “Super Stocker” packing a warmed 440 V-8; I actually had more fun riding in that than in another friend’s new 2006 Corvette, even though the Vette handled much better and was much more refined. I think it’s funny how people see an old muscle car and go, “WHOOOA, that thing is awesome! I wonder how fast it is…”, even though they don’t perform much better than a modern SUV. Oh well, like P.T. Barnum said, “there’s a sucker born every minute.”