Sorting it out
We know there is a replacement for the Grand Cherokee coming to the North Jefferson plant, based on Tom LaSorda’s statements. This should really be no surprise. It is planned to be lighter than the current model, also no surprise, given gas mileage issues and the reason why the current model is as heavy as it is (rumor has it the Mercedes people demanded changes based on their own needs). This vehicle will most likely end up being worked over and produced as a Mercedes, as the current one is.
Most likely some other vehicle will be built with it á la Nitro/Liberty. Prime candidates are the Aspen and/or the Commander. Maybe the Durango… it all depends how they want to play it. If the Grand Cherokee is the luxury version, a companion Dodge would make more sense than a companion Chrysler. On the other hand the Commander could be the true-luxury version, and the Grand Cherokee the sortakinda Oldsmobile version. They could also make a “lifestyle Dakota” from this.
Small cars… are a big open question. I suspect Chrysler has numerous paths under way and is trying to figure out which will work. There are two pacts in China, one with Chery and one with Great Wall, which might come to nothing or be the next small Chrysler, replacing the Horizon. There is the possibility of using the Fiat 500 chassis, and there is the thought that maybe engineers from Chrysler have been working on their own A-class car and that no matter who builds it, it is still coming from the plans that started to be drawn up last year or the year before. And then there’s the B-car, coming from the future Nissan Cube… and to confuse matters, the Nissan Versa spinoff to replace the Hyundai Atoz.
D-class (Sebring/Avenger) cars are coming, and I believe that they will be sourced from Chrysler, especially since they seem to be planning a whole series of vehicles at long last (the same plans were apparently made for numerous other projects). They’d want to keep control in-house if they were making sedans, coupes, hatchbacks, minivans, and crossovers all from the same source.
Hanging over all these future projects is the question of model cuts. It would not be insane to think that maybe the Durango and Aspen and Nitro will all be allowed to die. The Liberty may not even be needed, if the Grand Cherokee replacement can be built in two varieties - think Cherokee and Grand Cherokee. The old Jeep used to do things like that. I don’t know if the Liberty has a real following, but I doubt the Nitro does.
By the way, I’d appreciate it if your comments focused on what is likely to happen, not what you’d like to happen. You know my opinion, but here it is again:
Dodge - muscle cars (Challenger/Charger), Ram, Dakota, Caravan (sporty suspension tuning).
Chrysler - 300C, extended-wheelbase 300C (”New Yorker”), true-luxury T&C.
Plymouth - small crossover (”PT Cruiser”?), small cars, low-end, V6-only big car.
I doubt Chrysler will be back. Just going on statements made by Press, Nardelli and LaSorda I think this will happen:
Dodge:
Minivans, Pickups, Charger or Challenger
Chrysler:
Car line
Jeep:
CUV’s and Wrangler
To me that would be a shame, as I want it to be Dodge: Sporty mainstream, full line, Chrysler: Luxury, Jeep: SUV’s(no BOF SUV elsewhere in the company at all).
But based on their statements that is what I see happening.
My take.
I think that Chrysler should work with Nissan more on small cars, ditch the Chinese for reputations sake! I think they could make the Grand Cherokee into a TrailRated CUV if they wanted. Isn’t that what the Patriot is? Speaking of the liftbacks built at Belvedere, they need to retund the engines to work better with the CVT’s, or just drop the CVT’s all together. I’d be more than happy to shift my own gears if it means I will get 4 more MPG’s! And the Sebring and Avenger, they just need better interiors and the exteriors reworked, and marketed better. For Chrysler to pitch Dodge as mainstream performance, they need to build SRT variants of every model. Chrysler needs to drop every trim below Limited to be taken serious as a “luxo” brand. I think that for Chrysler to regain its nostalgic place, they need Plymouth!
But this is just what I think.
And also, their interior designs are NOW going in the right direction! The new Patriot and the Journey is just breath taking from other Chryslers!
Dodge will be sports cars (challanger and poss Demon, Viper will prob die but they should keep it) and trucks, Ram, light and heavy duty and Dakota. Chrysler will be minivans, and cars and but prob sourced from Nissan. Jeeps will be Wrangler and maybe 1 more. Chrysler will keep the development of minivans, Jeeps, and trucks in house but outscource everything else. I do see Nissan or poss cherry buying Chrysler in the near future. this is just to much for Ceberus to handle and they got in at the wront time. Liberty, Nitro, Aspen, Durango will die, there is no following. I do see a following for Grand Cherokee and they should being the Cherokee back.
The Cherokee never left. They just renamed it: Liberty.
Americans don’t want smaller cars; they want more fuel-efficient cars, and right now smaller cars are generally the way to get it.
Chrysler’s priorities need to be weight reduction, better aerodynamics, and more fuel efficient powetrains. The CVT, dual-mode hybrid, and upcoming Phoenix engines are steps in the right direction. I’m hoping to see more turbos offered as well, on the GEMA and Phoenix engines.
I believe that there is still a (small) market for BOF trucks, which is why I think that the Ram, Durango, and Dakota should be produced together at Warren Truck, and that these three should be the only Dodge trucks.
JNAP should produce the GC, Liberty, and Gladiator pickup. Drop the Aspen, Commander, and Nitro.
Toledo North should produce the Dodge Rebel coupe, sedan, and convertible, and the Jeepster convertible.
Belvidere should produce the Caliber, PT Cruiser, Patriot CUV, and Patriot pickup. Drop the Compass.
Sterling Heights should produce the Journey crossover and the Avenger sedan, coupe, and convertible. Drop the Sebring.
Brampton should produce a SWB LY Chrysler sedan and convertible (to take the Sebring’s place below the 300 in the Chrysler brand line-up), the Challenger coupe and convertible, and possibly a SWB LY Chrysler Pacifica crossover.
Saint Louis South should produce the next generation 300 and Charger, and the LWB LY New Yorker.
Close Toluca or use it to produce B-segment vehicles.
This is assuming that the Plymouth brand is not coming back, which is probably a fair assumption. However, if it did, I would give it the Hornet, the Caliber (restyled and possibly renamed), the PT Cruiser, the C- and D-segment sedans (Acclaim and Breeze - let Dodge keep the coupes and ‘verts), the Journey, a V-6 version of the Charger (Belvedere), and the Grand Caravan (renamed “Grand Voyager,” of course).
It may be that Jeep is going to mirror Land Rover somewhat–the GC, or whatever it’s called, would be sleeker and lighter, yet maintain off-road prowess, a la 2008’s LRX concept. The smaller “Discovery” equivalent could be a shorter version of the same platform, or they could very well keep the proven Liberty platform. That makes sense to me, given Chrysler’s need to improve quality. Reverting to Cherokee and Grand Cherokee nameplates would make sense either way. The ever-improving Patriot mirrors LR2. Wrangler echoes the Defender, and could easily grow into a family, to include a two and four door truck. If I had to guess, they seem to be going in this direction.
Bethlumboy, the Patriot pickup is a neat idea. Would be great to have a tough little diesel truck that gets 45 mpg. Sell that before India or China does.
I like your “short LY” idea as well. Would make Chrysler more of a prestige brand like Infiniti or BMW. And Cadillac is going in that direction. I don’t know if it’s entirely feasible, given cost. For example, 1-series BMW is awesome, yet too expensive as result of using 3 series chassis. Staying front drive would target the no. 1 selling luxury car ES350. Go for the greater volume.
It would be interesting to see how a “New Yorker” would play. I personally like that. It might work better to stay within the 300 name and have several models there. I think Chrysler’s territory is more or less going to be against ES350 and CTS, G37. Go for better styling and interior design than ES350. Steal directly from Lexus’s early playbook in selling 300’s–for the price of a 3 series or C-class, you get a larger 5-series or E-class size car.
I still think Dodge and Chrysler should get out of SUV’s–let Jeep have that territory. Journey ought to be the only crossover / SUV for Dodge. Anything more would get into Jeep territory. If Chrysler can have a crossover on the same platform as the Jeep, that might work–but it should be much more like an FX Infiniti than the Jeep. If they go that route, I’d hate to see a “Durango” clone built. If Dodge HAS to have a big SUV–maybe a stretched Journey would be feasible for that often-desired third row. I hope they DO NOT go the direction of having three crossover clones in their lineup.
Crysler once had one platform for just about everything (K). I personally hope they might be able to share enough parts that they could in-house the small cars, midsizers, and minivans and crossovers on one platform rather than using Nissan or various chinese components. Caliber / Sebring platform could be tooled up in Newark, for example, for a small sedan.
There is supposedly a “surprise” high-efficiency model coming in 09–I sure hope it is (finally) an American response to the Prius. I see Prius’s EVERYWHERE now. It is unbelieveable. Chrysler has got to get into that market. Such a product, combined with improvign quality, would turn Chrysler around and make Cerberus the owner of one of the best car companies in the world–an American version of BMW.
Chryco fan — my idea is that Dodge has the BOF “work” trucks (Durango, Dakota, Ram) and that Jeep covers the unibody (except for the BOF Wrangler) off-road and “lifestyle” trucks. A GC-based Gladiator pick-up could be offered in off-road, base, and luxury versions, as could the GC.
The Chrysler brand would have no trucks but it would keep the minivan and maybe get a mid-size crossover (SWB LY Pacifica). Also, if the Chrysler brand is going to move upmarket, they need to stop selling FWD C- and D-segment cars (PT, Sebring). If Plymouth isn’t coming back, then the PT needs to be moved upmarket as a larger MINI Clubman fighter. Throw a B-segment “baby PT” in there too and it could go up against the MINI Cooper.
I doubt very much that Chrysler has the technology to release a Prius-fighter by 2009. Hopefully ENVI is working on that but I think the most we can hope for in 2009 is a C-segment sedan/coupe (Rebel). Even that may be too much to expect.
You have good ideas, especially the untapped potential left for the PT. I would prefer to see the Gladiator, or whatever it will be called, replace the Dakota, with two and four door models; and improved versions of the Journey more or less replacing the Durango. This would avoid Gladiator and Dakota competing against each other and help Dodge’s CAFE average. Dakota is nto selling that well anyway. We’re basically going back to the late 80’s, early 90’s in terms of the SUV market–there’s room for a well engineered GC (sales are still good for the GC) but not a need for a Durango, in my view.
Chrysler definitely needs to stop selling downmarket cars, whether they be FWD or RWD. And stop advertising all three brands together. You don’t see Cadillac CTS and Chevrolet Aveo in the same TV ads, or Lexus LS with Yaris.
“I’d appreciate it if your comments focused on what is likely to happen, not what you’d like to happen.”
Assumptions: CAFE standard of 31 mpg in 2011 rising to 35 in 2020. Global peak oil production in 2010 - a leveling off of production through 2015. More regional resource wars, possible nuclear confrontation. Low to no US growth through 2011 as consumer credit remains tight, foreclosures remain high in FL, CA and NV. C-Segment becomes the new American family car gradually outselling D-segment. Challenger excitement will wane, the redesigns of 300/Charger will not have the impact of the originals, gas approaching $5/gal will lead Chrysler to consolidate LY and JS into a front-drive D-segment sedan (Dodge), extended wheelbase sedan (Chrysler) and convertible (Chrysler) built either at Brampton or SHAP sometime after 2012. 70% of all dealers will be C-D-J by 2012 up from 55% in 2008.
Product for 2009-2012:
B-Segment built in Japan by Nissan
Belvidere - Caliber, Compass, Patriot, PM or JS sedan
Sterling Heights - Sebring, Sebring Convertible, Avenger, Journey
Brampton - 300, Charger, Challenger
Connor - closed (Viper cancelled)
Jefferson - Grand Cherokee, Commander
Toluca - closed (PT cancelled)
Warren - Ram, Dakota
Windsor - T&C, GC
STL South - closed
Newark - closed, (Durango and Aspen cancelled after 2009)
Saltillo - closed
STL North - closed
Toledo South - closed
Toledo North - Liberty, Wrangler, (Nitro cancelled)
CHRYSLER HAS SOME OF THE BEST BULIT CARS ON THE ROAD AT THIS TIME…THEY DO NEED SOME GAS MILAGE CARS THOUGH THE AVENGER AND SEBRING ARE VERY GOOD CHARGER
NOT BAD AT ALL…SO WHY ALL THE BAD PRESS …MAYBE THE OTHER CAR LINES ARE WORRIED????