Time to leave NASCAR
It’s another embarrassing season for Dodge in NASCAR as the teams struggle to make top ten finishes and the PR people struggle to find good news in one bad race after another.
This is not the way it should be for Chrysler, which once dominated NASCAR. Of course, that was back in the days when they raced production cars. Heavily modified production cars, to be sure, with every team cheating as well as they could, but still, the company with the best production designs could win, and Plymouth and Dodge routinely did.
Then came the many rule changes designed to put Plymouth and Petty in their place.
Now, NASCAR costs many millions of dollars that are sorely needed elsewhere. Chrysler is in bankruptcy and there is no need to spend that money on a pointless attempt to garner publicity in racing’s version of professional wrestling. The contract can be broken without penalty, I suspect — and now is the time to do it. Let them get out while they still can.
Chrysler needs all its engineers and money for the production products, especially now that Fiat’s whole lineup is becoming available. I don’t think anyone believes Americans will buy rebadged Fiats without any modifications, and I doubt that simply shoving Pentastar V6 engines into Alfas will result in a car that’s appropriate for American conditions any more than dropping a Mercedes diesel into the Grand Cherokee resulted in the ideal SUV.
Bringing unmodified imports into the US usually fails; that’s why the Camry and Avalon are largely engineered in the United States now, and why the Corolla is worked over by American engineers and sold here in a different configuration than in Japan or Europe. That’s why the Omni and Horizon were the first successful SIMCAs on these shores. The more engineers and money that is put into modifying those Fiats for American sale, the better off Chrysler and its customers will be. The last thing we need is for Chrysler to be wasting its money and engineers’ time on setting up cars you can’t buy to go around in circles in a game that’s run by a family with an anti-Chrysler grudge almost as big as the one at that un-named “consumer magazine.”
So come on, guys. Start off on the right foot. Put the money where it’s needed. If you want to market, use Google to direct people to your fine web sites (or to ours). It’s cheaper, more direct, and probably more effective.
I agree. NASCAR ain’t what it used to be. Does anyone really believe that it’s “Win on Sunday, buy on Monday”? I hardly think any of the manufacturers today are selling cars because of NASCAR participation. Probably because the cars being raced have little similarity beyond the name with what’s in the showrooms.
Well, the engines are similar to what you could buy on the dealer’s lot. About 30 years ago.
I disagree on the point of “another embarassing season”, the Sprint Cup seasons’ only starting. Only had 10 of 36 races yet. Dodge has only two teams this year down from four in 2008, and only 6 cars on the track to win out of 43, down from up to 14 last year. To date, Kurt Busch has already won a race this year, in March, and as of the last race, was #1 in points standings so far. Ford, with all their money only has 2 wins this season, and Toyota 3 and Chevy 4. Take a look at Nascar.com and see how many teams and cars they have on the track. “NOT BAD” for the underdog DODGE. Last year Dodge opened up the season with a 1-2 finish at the Daytona 500, and claimed 6 of the top 10 spots. Dodges posted 50 top-tens all year.
The Penske team is really turning it on this year with the new Dodge R6 engine. Petty’s team don’t have the new R6 engine yet, and its just time for Mr.Gillett to start spending some of his money if he wants to contend. The manufactutrer don’t give them everything.
There’s a couple of Dodge drivers he has that should have been let go a couple of years ago because they are mediocre drivers at best, and if you put them in the best cars on the track they still would’nt win a race. That was some of the problem.
Lets take a look at Dale Earnhardt Jr. He’s with Chevy and Hendrick Motorsports, the highest ranking Chevy team there is in Nascar. Nascar practically gave him a win last year, I think to shut up the fans because he is the top fan attraction at Nascar, and could’nt find a win last year or this year to date. It’s definately not because he don’t have the equipment on the track, he has the best. People can’t seem to understand he ain’t Earnhardt Sr. and never will be. This is “not” the same person people!
I agree with Nascar being the WWF of motorsports, I said that a long time ago. Its money that talks to these people, and whoever got the most of it, they will cater to. See how far Toyota has come in only two years of racing. See how many Chevy teams jumped ship when they arrived, (and Michael Waltrips’ dodge team). I don’t support Nascar for this reason and the fact that they have bad blood with Chrysler. I never buy Nascar goods or show any support for them, however Dodge decided to get back into this (they should never have returned)and so Being a full-blown MOPAR gear-headed enthusiast, I have to support what they are doing on the track. When they do win, It feels great to be the underdog with all these statistics stacked against you. GO-DODGE-GO. They’re not in F1, they’re not in IRL, so if your a race fan and supporter, you don’t have much to look forward to. MOPAR is tops in NHRA also, with mighty HEMI-power. So for a company that’s entered Bankruptcy, that’s pretty good. The cars on the track have changed alot over the years due to the safety aspect of racing, and also Nascar wants to have control over everything, but If I could afford a new Charger, I would go right now and get me one. Because believe it or not, the image on the track still excites people. Bankruptcy or not.
I wonder about this site? Is this a Chrysler/Dodge/Plymouth enthusiast site, or just another car info space? I thought this was the top MOPAR haven. I’ve been reading alot of confusing comments throughout posts here, made by people who can’t be MOPAR enthusiasts, and have alot of negative statements to make about Chrysler. Lets talk positive about Chrysler and look at accomplishments and acheivements that this site deserves. If somebody’s confused about why they found themselves
at this site, and they like their Ford, or Chevy, or Toyota, then go visit that site. I’ve never even been to any of those. (do they exist?) Lets not succomb to the levels of the media and just go on and complain about how bad Chrysler are at this or how bad they are at that. If this is your train of thought, I am sorry to tell you that you are not an enthusiast. Move on to another brand.
I Strongly DISAGREE !!!!! We have Kurt in the top ten and Sam Hornish isn’t doin to bad either. I think as long as the judge is ok with it, then let them stay. Come on, us real MOPAR MEN have to have something to watch on the weekends. Baseball and football sure won’t due for me.
To clarify, I think Dodge’s efforts given their budgets have been outstanding, as shown by their Daytona finish. But you’ll notice they’re not allowed to keep on winning like that; suddenly there are rule changes to make sure the outcomes are “correct” (as you said.)
For the same money they could go into SCCA big time, though I don’t think SCCA is televised?
I could be wrong about NASCAR. I’m sure someone at Chrysler ran some numbers. I’m just hoping their market research is correct and not based on the idea that they’d always be winning. Becuase I suspect that once they really start to take advantage of that new engine, NASCAR will make some changes to set them back again.
Dave I’m not sure but some SSCA races are televised on the Speed channel network.
I remember once some talks of a rival circuit to rival the F-1 but it didn’t go further. Maybe NASCAR need a new rival circuit like the USFL was against the NFL in the 1980s (and there talks of a new USFL for 2010).
Then there IS an alternative to NASCAR. SCCA is, as I understand it, a true stock car series.
I used to wish Chrysler would race the 300 in SCCA against Cadillac when they fielded the CTS a few years ago. I think Cadillac’s effort certainly boosted their car’s credibility.
I will miss Dodge if it does pull from NASCAR. I agree with the comments above–there’s not a lot to cheer about in “Chryslerland” at the moment. Seeing Busch top in points and finishing well every week in that blue Charger makes me feel good.
That said, the editor makes good points about Chrysler’s resources. I’m reading Chrysler will have to delay 2010 and ‘11 models, will have to finish building the old cars before it can retool for the new ones. That is absolutely terrible! If I had to chose between getting the ‘10 and ‘11 cars out on time or seeing Dodge pull out of motorsports I’d take the latter. Chrysler has GOT to get the new models out on time, without problems.
We were led to believe bankruptcy would be quick and would cause no major disruption. But in the last few days it comes out what truly is in store–with the shutdowns, delays. I’m still wanting to trust the leadership, but I feel the “Auto task force” may be as bad for Chrysler as Jurgen Schremp was. The “quick” bankruptcy looks like it will work as well as the “merger of equals.” With all the money being spent on AIG without blinking an eye, why can’t the government loan Chrysler a paltry $5 billion to keep factories running and tool up for the new model years? Loans, not giveaways. As it’s heading, the taxpayer WILL have to foot the bill if this company implodes and is sold off to satisfy the hedge funds. The hedge funds that are still holding out for their pound of flesh should examine what kind of country they want to live in, or perhaps they have their homes in Ecuador or France already so they could care less about the good ol’ USA.
Hemihead is 100% correct. NASCAR is a joke compared to what it was 40 years ago, but this is now and we are there so let’s give 100%. Too bad for us though, what all Dodge teams have the new R6, NASCAR will change the rules once again to cut down Dodge… that’s the way it ALWAYS is, didn’t we learn anything from the Craftsman Truck Series???
While it’s great to see “dodges” running in NASTYCAR, it ain’t what it used to be. Since allowing the toyopet to be called an American car, I am pretty fed up with the whole business; yeah, basically, it’s not so much about racing what you “brung” anymore, it’s a business. Chrysler can do just fine without NASCAR, by spending more of its resources with its customers,getting them more involved in the loyalty and owner experience.
Nothing is ever what it used to be, lets live in the “now”, the automotive marketplace ain’t what it used to be. There was no imports over-running the industry, to run in Nascar in the “used-to-be”.
Don’t get me wrong here, I am not a big fan of Nascar, and definatly not of Bill France (Ed McMahon) and sons, especially since he always treated Chrysler like manure. The more I read about Chrysler and Nascars past, the more I dislike Nascar. But, I don’t think now is the time to drop out of Nascar. When and if things get really bad for them, and there dosen’t seem to be a hope in hell left, then they can drop out and not have to worry about any repercussions on image or sales.
I know Nascar dosen’t drive every person to the dealerships, however, I don’t think they want to lose anymore customers at this time. A drop out of Nascar at this critical time will definatly send a message to the public that the’re gone. I don’t beleive that they ever should have returned, at least they could say that they were banned in the past and have no will to return to that organization. Now if they do pull out and they recover and try to return once again, they will certainly be a joke and no one would ever take them serious, good luck finding a driver.
Like I said earlier, they are cut back to 2 teams and about half the cars, so that should save them something now. They never chased after the teams that left to “spice” up any deals to keep them, and I remember Ryan Neuman (Daytona 500 winner 2008) commenting on his surprise that when he announced he was leaving the Penske team, that Dodge never even contacted him to ask why or show any concern about his departure. Well we all know why they didn’t now.
Nascar has all the glory and bells and whistles that money can buy for the spectators, amazing really, especially when you compare hype vs. hype. F1, IRL, or even NHRA can’t come close to matching all the pre-building up and hype Nascar provides to put off their shows. Jet fighters flying over head, big money rock bands playing, wicked purse sizes for winners, etc… it truly is the WWF of racing. Too bad the SCCA didn’t take off like they did, because they have a better organization not controlled by one person.
They do have some SCCA events televised on the SPEED channel. Lots of imports there though, rarely see a Dodge, maybe a Viper now and then, depending on what race category it is.
I wish another organization would start, as a competitor to Nascar, kind of like the WWE has pretty much decimated WWF. Nascar has the monopoly on Sunday racing right now. Did you know its watched by more people than any other sport? So there is definatly room for another organization. Anybody (insert millionaire of choice) reading this out there…. now’s the time to start one.
As for Nascar being Biased, its as sure as rain. Getting too easy to predict actually. If you got the big bucks to court them, they are going to swing every way to Sunday to make sure your the hit.
Sickening? Yes, but right now its all we got, and besides that, I am much more concerned about Chrysler and the shot gun wedding to Fiat to worry about Nascar.
Please tell me what Toyota off the showroom floor has a chance at outperforming a stock Charger R/T or 300C? The Tundra may be the only thing that could come close. Toyota shouldn’t even be allowed to compete until they come up with a produciton RWD V8 Camry that you can walk into the showroom and buy. This is why NASCAR has become irrelevant to me. Sure, it’s a great series of social events with lots of beer and cuties parading around. But there’s too little “stock car” and diminishing American content……and, yes, I know Camrys are built here, but you’ll never get me to say they’re an American car……and Chryslers have gone from German ownership to perhaps Italian! What is this world coming to?
“kind of like the WWE has pretty much decimated WWF”
Didn’t the WWF change it’s name to WWE because of a lawsuit with some nature organization with the same name?
Anyway, yeah it’s nice to see Dodges winning, but there’s bigger things going on and I really don’t care about NASCAR. I do watch it once in a while, but Bill France just seems like an A-hole, and I stopped really caring when they let toyota in.
If this is true than Chrysler is finished:
http://www.leftlanenews.com/more-chrysler-vehicles-could-follow-the-viper-to-the-automotive-graveyard.html#more-17666
Sell off the Ram, Wrangler! Unbelievable…… Those are two of the three best selling models. I think Fiat is showing its true colors. Once again, the hard-working employees of Chrysler have been betrayed, loyal customers have been tricked. I was wanting so ahrd to give the current admin a chance on thses issues, but what a stab in the back by the government!
World Wildlife Federation, I think.
What changers did Nascar institute against Dodge in the truck series?
Oh my. This thread has brought up so many different areas of discussion I don’t hardy know where to begin.
Well, the subject began as NASCAR before it switched to racing in general so that should be a good spot to begin my tirade. First off NASCAR has nothing what-so-ever to do with stock cars and has not for years. Racing takes more than an engine to win. Back when Karl Kiekhaefer was blowing away all the competition (and there was a lot more competition back then) it was assumed it was all due to the great power of the 300’s engines. Many forget, or even ever knew, that the 1954 championship was won by a Chrysler piloted by Lee Petty. He had finished second in points in 1953 driving a Dodge. Yes, these were Hemi’s but their HP lead was not that great to give them all that much of an advantage. The whole car had to be competitive. And, yes, the team was a major factor, just as it is today.
Now days the teams are all running the same car. I hesitate to call them race cars because with all the money invested into these overweight tubs they are decidedly archaic. Look at these things and tell me where the heck 3400 lbs are hidden. Lighter cars means safer cars and higher fuel mileage and less pollution and … The only thing that distinguishes one brand from another on the race track is the headlight stickers and what ever name is plastered on it. Then NASCAR still makes up rules on the spot in order to determine just who is allowed to win. Now if anyone does not understand that the people that spend the most win the most they should not bother reading on. Dodge has not had the huge sums available to spend that GM, Ford and Toyota has poured into NASCAR. No I do not mean into their teams, I mean into NASCAR in one form or another. NASCAR is business, huge business and like any business, does everything it can to dominate its market. I wish I could find out just how much Toyota spent to get into NASCAR. Way beyond the cost of the cars. And how they managed to become so competitive in so short a time. Dodge is has Penske racing, one of most successful racing concerns in the country, if not the world, and still can’t buy enough top five finishes to be considered successful.
And how about that version 6 motor. I think they would go faster if they had a Hemi. But that is not allowed, even though there are hundreds of thousands of them on the highways and byways of America. NASCAR is a dinosaur refusing to realize its extinction is around the corner. It is difficult to even classify it as racing. Most NASCAR fans are truly there to see the “big one” that always comes along sooner or later. Yes, there many a good man out there putting their lives on the line but the truth is if NASCAR doesn’t want you to win, you won’t.
Chrysler does not need to be throwing good money after bad in order to develop ways to get more power out of archaic engine designs when they can’t build a high mileage, smooth running, four cylinder that would do much more to increase sales in this day and age than the pitiful showings NASCAR allows them to make on the track. Race on Sunday but show me good gas mileage on Monday. Racing used to seriously improve the breed. This has not been the case with NASCAR for something like thirty or so years.
Mopar may make money on its race and high performance lines. Chrysler as a whole needs to spend its cash developing competitive, road-worthy vehicles that appeal to the general public. And, as much as I love the Viper. It is also passé and should either be sold off or just terminated. Remember those glory days when the Viper was at the very pinnacle of international GT racing? Using an admittedly (highly) modified road car? Almost like 1966 all over again. It was the Viper that won, not some racing associations spec car.
Today’s world demands cars that start and stop, ride well and sound nice, are fuel efficient and safe and can move along smartly enough to not embosses themselves when entering a freeway. That is a pretty tall order and several manufacturers have a head start on Chrysler. Chrysler must put its limited funds where it will do some good.
so what if there are not as many Dodges in Nascar !!! AND…so what if they are not winning !!! it only takes one in the race to give me incentive to watch it even if it is a backfield marker ! i still get a lump in my throat every time i see a Dodge out there on the track. so yes….it’s important to me!
Sure its important! Its important to Chrysler that thousands of people who watch these races see a Dodge sticker on a car. Its important to the people who fill the Dodge section of the grandstands
at the races every Sunday. Yes, Nascar is in it to make money, so is Chrysler. Does anybody think Chrysler is only in it because they are sad and want to reminisce about the past? They want to advertise and sell cars. I can guarantee that when those lowly few Dodges are at the front of the field or win the race it means alot to those people. 6 cars out of 43! Your damn right it means something. I hope they can continue. Everytime I watch and see a Dodge marching to the front of the field I can’t stop grinin’ and get a lump in my throat.
GO-DODGE-GO!!!!
Even in the 60’s NASCAR drove Ronnie Householder crazy. Chevy and Ford were running multi-carbs to try and compete with the Hemi, then the Hemi restrictor plates, yes the are still used today BUT they were invented to slow the Hemi, they effectively banned the HEMI and now they are pretty much using ‘spec’ engines in ‘spec cars’. You know it’s true, what version of ANY current NASCAR engine was ever sold for the street? In ‘66 they came out with the 1000 engine rule, that’s why we got the Street Hemi, remember?
As far as Craftsman Truck goes, Dodge couldn’t buy a win, then suddenly in 2002 they were the ones to beat, untouchable, I couldn’t figure it except that higher compression was allowed beginning that year. This went on for about 4 years until Toyota appears (who also couldn’t buy a win) and after a year and a half, with Dodge winning all the time, LIKE A SWITCH WAS FLIPPED Dodge stops winning and Toyota can’t be beat! Since that day Dodge has one only one race! Could this series not be any more FIXED???
But to walk away now is only telling the few remaining people who still have faith in the company that it’s time to go buy Toyota or Honda, ‘cause we quit! No way baby – GO DODGE!!!
My 09 Challenger R/T gets so many looks, and people confuse it (namewise) for a Charger (it looks more like a “real” Charger (68-74) than does the current version). To bail from NASCAR, as much as I hate the circus it has become, would be a mistake.