The New Iacocca
October 14th, 2009 • by David Zatz
U.S. Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood called Chrysler CEO Sergio Marchionne “the next generation of Lee Iacocca.”
If this is true, we can expect in the next few years:
- Chrysler will come out with a highly popular compact car which is far more efficient and pleasant to drive than its mainstay cars, with a bigger interior than the current Sebring and a smaller interior, faster and more economical, at the same price or less.
- Inside the corporation, inefficiencies will be ruthlessly sought out and destroyed, and standards will be raised.
- Chrysler will then quickly replace all its other products with this car and untold variants of it. Along the way, nameplates will be moved around every few days to make sure everyone is confused. The Chrysler 300 label will be applied to each and every car in the lineup at some point, in some years applying to two different cars at once.
- Chrysler will link up with Maserati and… oops, they already are linked with Maserati. Again.
- Chrysler will then sit around and grow fat and inefficient again. People will become both complacent and dissatisfied.
- The auto press will start mocking Chrysler because nearly every model is based on the same architecture.
- A talented, forceful executive will start pushing Chrysler to revolutionize its business, aided by people recently brought in from a new acquisition (let’s say, just for fun, Subaru.)
- Marchionne will see this executive, know that he will look foolish if the new guy outdoes his success, and appoint the most cowardly, foolish, complacent executive he can find at General Motors.
- Eventually the new guy will either give Chrysler away in return for executive bonuses, or will be pushed out in favor of a new rainmaker, and the cycle will restart.
- Ten years later, Transportation Secretary Jacob Richardson will call the newest new guy “the next generation of Sergio Marchionne.”
Really? Your parody of Iaccoca is spot on! Gave me a good chuckle. People forget that Iaccoca wasn’t such a great hero as people try to make him out to be. I never cared for his politics or his policies. As you indicated he sat on his fat cigar smoking butt and let Chrysler go down again near 1985 for his lack of development for new vehicles. That was only part of his demeanor. He was a sneaky boss in that he played one against the other. Not a good thing.
I guess Ray LaHood is a bit too optimistic or he drinked or smoked something unorthodox ;-) I wonder if his text would had worked better if he mentionned then Marchionne would had been the next Carlos Ghosn? Lol :-D
Iacocca isn’t the only CEO to ever play the game of pitting his underlings against each other. One of the CEOs I worked for in the past thought that kind of competition kept people at the top of their game. What he didn’t consider was the resentment and backstabbing that it also incited. Sometimes those internal turf wars didn’t just hit the senior execs, it hit all the people working under them as other people tried to keep resources away from them, sabotage their projects, and hinder their advancement on many levels.
Isn’t corporate politics a lot of fun?
Yes, and it seems Marchionne is one of those guys. Not a recipe for success.
I just wish those that sit at the top would get off their Ego Sticks and start building the kind of cars that people want instead of coping the other guys. Chrysler use to be the Leader of Styling, Innovation and Engineering, what happen to the desire to be the BEST?
Good question, Bill. Greed. The desire to chase the “big” dollars. Even this brush with corporate death has not let the lesson sink in. The old adage about “if you build it, they will come” just doesn’t seem to be in the mental grasp of those that want to build and sell autos. The stock holder demands for profits cloud the judgment of those that design, engineer, build and sell the cars of America. Look at what is occurring with Toyota, because it took its eyes off the way they had conducted their business. The Koreans who are NOW on the ball, are quickly gaining in places no one ever thought they would or even could. I test drove a New Hyandai “Genesis”, and let me tell you all, it is every bit as good as a Lexus, and far better than a Mercedes. As well, interior wise, it beats the rather spartan BMW by a long shot. Style wise, it sets a new standard, in my opinion.
Daimler bought into Chrysler because Chrysler asked. They did NOT see the cars as much as the 10-12 BILLION dollar war chest that Lutz had engineered when he was running the outfit, even with Iaccoca still there. That was Chrysler’s time. It didn’t last long enough. Those that do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it. Like Dave said, this Marchionne or whatever is another Iaccoca.
“I just wish those that sit at the top would get off their Ego Sticks and start building the kind of cars that people want instead of copying the other guys.”
Amen, brother. (I agree with you, too. Curtis.)
At this point I think a negative response to LaHood’s comment is an overreaction. Up to now anything I’ve heard about Marcionne has been anecdotal. What little I do know about him, courtesy of the media, is that he appears to be a turn-around guy and a builder. The fact that somebody thinks he’s the next Iacocca may mean nothing more than he has the ability to save the company. There is no evidence yet that he intends to follow the same pattern and have the same personality and leadership traits as Iacocca. For me it’s too early to tell.
Dusty, I assume you’re right. I was writing tongue-in-cheek. What I AM concerned about is the apparently high level of arrogance, the overloading of executives with too many roles on too many continents, the demands that people work 12-14 hour days, etc.
What I worry about is the morale of the troops at Chrysler. Between watching the place get cut up again for the umpteenth time and the continuing financial challenges, you have to wonder what the people left are thinking. Talented guys like Ralph Gilles have to be wondering if there are better options out there rather than to keep going through the upheaval at Chrysler. Has the company shrunk to the point where there is not longer a critical mass to sustain new product development and be able to produce something very competitive? Or is it going to be more treading of water?
Good golly, Dave, you’ve just described my company!
Of course, being in Rochester, New York, we have a Delphi facility and I know a couple of my former colleagues who are working exactly as you say. But, they’ve already been doing it for better than a year. I haven’t talked to them in a while, so I wonder if they’ve been asked to do more since the bailout.
Which brings us back to http://www.allpar.com/weblogs/2009/10/13/out-by-5/
Does anyone reall know what to make of the new guy. I for one have put my confidence in the fact that Fiat has more of a responsibility to make the company work. This is not the raid brought to us by Diamler courtesy of Mr. Eaton.
It is true that Bob Lutz had to have had a role in the wonderful vehicles we had in the ninetys. However, doesn’t anyone else remember that is was Iacocca that was in charge at the time? The press refered to the LH as (Lee’s) last hope, but we had some great cars then. Also, do we need to mention what happened when the 1994 Ram pick-up hit the showroom? Over 300% increase in sales the first your without a ClubCab. What about the Grand Cherokee? Talk about expanding a market segment.
I’ve been selling Chryslers since 1991 and can tell you that the people coming in 10-15 years-ago were completly different than those from before. Our customers have come to expect exciting and inovative cars and trucks. Styling is what brings people in the door. The tactile qualities like superior suspension, steering and braking is what makes someone want to drive a Chrysler. This is what Marketing needs to get out to the public. If all they’ve ever heard is HEMI or that the car has issues then we’ll never get back home.
Please don’t stand by and let this moment pass by. Buy a new Chrysler, Dodge or Jeep today. Bring your family and friends in to buy one as well. If you want to have something to go to you will need to do your part as well. Maybe a few more people need to spend some time in the showroom and see what the media and everyone’s lack of enthusiasm is doing to a great car company.
Yes, Nelson, Lee was in charge. However, the engineering and the “car guy” attitude was from Lutz and Francois Castinag whose magnificent grasp of how to build cars got the ideas into sheet metal. That is how Chrysler developed engines and automobiles idea to production line in 18 months in some cases! Let us not forget the Iaccoca was a very jealous type, and while he should have let Lutz become the new Chrysler President, he brought in Eaton from Europe, no less, in an effort to remain in his place. Iaccoca had already driven off many more capable people than himself, who left in disgust because the board would not buck Iaccoca off, when he should have been gone. Just to let you know, I currently have two Chrysler Products, a Town and Country and a PT Cruiser. I have had ZERO sum problems with either. Routine maintenance is all they ask, and they deliver dependable, reliable, safe service, day after day.
Nelson C, I feel your pain, but I have to be honest with you, there isn’t much in a Chrysler showroom that I want to buy right now. Keep in mind that 2/3 of all the vehicles I’ve owned have been Chrysler products and I own two now. What I want, I can’t afford. What I can afford, I don’t want. So, I’m squeezing as much life out of what I’ve got as I can. The uncertainty of the economy doesn’t help. Big ticket items are off my list for now. I’m sure I’m not alone.
I’m appreciate your empathy Scott, but I never said that I was in any pain. When I read the discussions that are posted on all manner of sites it’s your pain that I’m respondiing to. I understand that we are all making do with less than before. I’m not trying to be insensitive to poeple’s plight. Folks can say what they want about car people, but we are doing what we can with what we are given. This can be anything from the quality of the product to the situation the client is facing. There is nothing in it for me until there is something in it for you.
What I am trying to say is that we have (and have had) some mighty fine cars and trucks in the market over the past number of years. All that I wish to point out is that it’s the 1970’s all over again. Pick you contention from emissions, fuel economy, safety regulations or anything else that Washington and conjure up. There may not be another time when we can purchase the kind of vehicles we have today. Let’s hope that this is not the truth.
Nelson C, forgive me if I misinterpreted what you were saying.
I agree with you that this is history repeating itself. Government seems determinsed to tell us what we’re going to drive. Hemi-engined Chargers/300s, Challengers, and trucks may not have much of a future. Buy ‘em while you can. They’ll be the next sacrifice to the gods 15-20 years from now in the next Cash for Clunkers program.
I wonder when the Mustang II is going to make another appearance? Perhaps this time on a Focus platform instead of a Pinto/Bobcat?
Scott’s mention of the Ford Focus forces me to comment. I recently had a ride in one, and although I’d say it’s a vehicle worth considering based on my brief encounter, I will wonder why anyone would think the Focus is a better car than an Avenger. My complaint with the Avenger is it’s far too noisy engine. But likewise the Focus came off raspy and much more unrefined. The Avenger I drove had a solid steel feel with a quiet suspension, excellent handling and a very decent ride. The Focus comes in a fair bit behind the Avenger in those areas, in my opinion anyways. Although looks is subjective, I think the Avenger is stunning, at least compared to a Focus.
Iacocca had a positive effect on Chrysler in a number of ways. He was an ardent talker that came off as a no bull, straight-shooter, perhaps one of the most convincing pitch men ever. He had vision and persuasion for the most part. He may have saved the company, but he falsely takes credit for the K-platform and the minivan, both of which were in design phase before he got there. He doesn’t take credit for the A604 disaster, even though I’ve read from several sources he rushed it in to production without enough testing.
With no offense to my Italian sweetheart, somebody once referred to Lee in a magazine article as “a loud mouth dago.” (Carol Shelby?) I have reason to believe the comment was more accurate than his public image.
I don’t see anything wrong with any current offerings from Chrysler. I think they all look the way we expected them to look from Chrysler. I would’nt hesitate to buy any of those vehicles. I talked to many people who own some of those vehicles and they love them. My sister bought a new Caliber 6 months ago and loves it. She says its way better than the leased GM Uplander she just got rid of. She said she was tired of going to the dealer for repairs on it. I took it for a drive and only I need a minivan for my family, I would’nt hesitate to buy one. It has a nice solid ride, and I didn’t get the feeling of sitiing on the ground like I usually do when I get in a car from the van. It has ample power and I thought the interior was really nice. Alot of reviews in the past complained of cheap plastic interior. Thats B.S. What normal Joe cares anyway? Show me a car that don’t have plastic in it. If you want to see cheap plastic interiors, go buy a cavalier. If a person wants a high tech super rich looking interior, then go buy a Ferarri, or a BMW. You won’t however, pay what you would for a Caliber. As for the “dragged through the mud, slandered, car magazine “experts” dumped upon Sebring, I talked to several people who owns those cars and several said the loved them and some said its the best car they owned. So, don’t believe what you hear and read from those overpaid, kick-backed paid, who gets way too much attention car magazine reviewers. Go to your nearest dealer and check them out. As for the Avenger, always loved the look. Probably my wifes next car, or the Journey. Awesome looking, way better then the Ford clones or the GM borings. As for the loud engine noise someone mentioned earlier, thats a matter of personal taste. They wouldn’t be able to get it loud enough for me! Kids around here can’t get enough of the Charger. They love them. Huge car with lots of power, mean looking, terrorize the neighbourhood. They get way more than they would with those small imports and then have to spend a mint to get the look and performance they want. Challenger…….breathtaking! Ram truck is a league of its own. Its beyond “the truck.” Jeeps, nobody comes close. So if you can’t find yourself a vehicle in that list, then your not in the market for a new vehicle.
Lets give the new guy a chance! Geeez, you have the ship scuttled before the maiden voyage. Now you guys like “Chrysler” right? Am I on the right site here? You know if you just want to complain about something or just be negative, we have facebook and twitter. Go there and try those out.
As for the Iacocca bashing, you know that guy did alot for Chrysler in the past. His name is synonomous with Chrysler. I didn’t even know who the guy was until the K car. But I can tell you alot of people know who he is now, but they couldn’t tell you who is CEO of GM or Ford, etc…now or then. No he didn’t invent the K car. It wouldn’t take a genius to figure out you don’t single handedly run a car company. There were alot of other people involved and Iacocca wouldn’t hesitate to point out who did what. There were alot of egos and jealous people who worked at that company.
Lutz wasen’t an easy guy to work with either. He later admitted he had made huge mistakes in his career, none more damaging than his outrageous disrespect for Iaccoca, that cost him the chance to be Chrysler’s CEO. As for Eaton, Iaccoca admitted it was his biggest mistake to make Eaton CEO,
and we all know what that coward did.
Indeed, as someone mentioned earlier, its the 70’s all over again! Gasoline prices are all over the place, Toyota is “junk” again, Detroit (God love ‘em) have the muscle cars out, government all of a sudden feel environmentally responsible, and jobs are down the toilet.
I was too young and missed it the first time, but by God I made sure there was a HEMI in the garage this time around!
As they say in the 70’s, “Dig It!”
I don’t wish to engage in a match here. But HEMIhead has made some assumptions that while they seem varnished on the surface, they are flawed underneath. Toyota is hardly, “junk”, and is selling still quite well. Their spot in the American psyche is still assured, and unless something really catastrophic occurs, they will go on, more than likely larger than before. They have taken note of the bump in the road, and give them their due, taking all out action to correct the impressions. Getting a recall because of a floor mat?? Really? Well, that goes to show the mental capability of people, and moreover, the regulatory efforts of this high priced, spend thrift government.
As for Iaccoca, again, he is getting credit where none should be offered. He took ALL the credit for the cars that other people built for Chrysler, and never mentioned, at least to the stock holders, or the main characters on the Board of Directors, who the main players were. Until Lutz happened, that is, and Chrysler bought out AMC, bringing Castining in as head engineer. When shown the first presentation of the “cab forward” design, the 1987 Portofino, built by Tom Gale, Iaccoca snorted “that……… will NEVER sell!” He dismissed it out of hand, and wouldn’t entertain any more about it. However, cooler head prevailed, and slowly, but with ever increasing exposure, the Portofino began the various shows and auto regalia routines. It NEVER failed to draw huge crowds. Besides being a prototype, it was an actual driver, and was used repeatedly. However, it was not the first application of “cab forward” design. Ford had beaten everyone to the punch with the roomy, and good selling Taurus. They did not, however, capitalize on the “CAB FORWARD” use in their advertisements. While Chrysler piddled along, the Taurus kept on improving, and consequently, selling better and better. Automotive types recognized the cab forward design, but again, Ford did not capitalize on the use of the nomenclature. Finally, some 3 (THREE!) years later, 1991, Iaccoca happened upon some of his people, Gale, Lutz, at the Detroit auto show, looking at the Taurus. He wanted to know why Chrysler wasn’t building anything like it? Handily, he was escorted to the Portofino display where, he gushed that they should be building something like that! It was, of course, a fateful decision, but, had those guys destroyed the concept Portofino when Iaccoca nixed the concept, the LH series of world beater cars probably would never have happened. Car guy? Not really, but he sure took credit for the design, and the tremendous profits. He tried to bury Lutz, but, Lutz was honest to a fault. Sure, he characterized Iaccoca as being “out of date” because he was. The LH cars should have been on the market in 1989, not late 1992! The rest, as we know, is history.
There will be a history piece about Iaccoca on the site soon. Be sure to look for it. It will explain in better detail why I didn’t respect Iaccoca nor his politics.
Well, they are junk to me. They still can’t figure out untreated metal rust.
The only good thing about it is you can buy one and when it starts it’s rust-death
spiral you can bring it back under a recall and get a good above book value return.
As for Iacocca, only for him you wouldn’t have this site to complain on because Chrysler
would long be toast. I didn’t see anyone else looking to save the company.
Maybe someone here could be CEO?
I’m a young Mopar fan, way past the Iaccoca era. First time I ever heard of Chrysler it had Daimler before it. So I only know what I hear of Iaccoca. But what I do know is if it weren’t for him Chrysler would have never got the loan gaurantees to stay afloat. His politics and demeanor are beside the point that he did manage to keep Chrysler alive during some rough times. If Marchionne at least has this one trait then I think the other stuff can be put on the backburner, at least until this recession turns around.
Well, excuse me for trying to be truthful. There were MANY other people around just as capable as your beloved Lido. And there are a lot of older Taurus on the road yet, if you look around, but that wasn’t the point. That you won’t see it is your prerogative. One of the more capable, and not mentioned in the running was Roger Penske. He has shown his turn around capabilities time after time. Had good ol’ boy Lee not jumped into the opportunity to rub Henry Ford’s nose in it, then Penske would have been Chairman of Chrysler, at that time. And without Greenwald, (another Ford refugee) the Financial genius, to hold Lee out front, the loan would not have happened as it did. Iaccoca DID NOT single handed obtain the loan guarantee. That is impossible thinking. It took a small army. He may have been the focal point, but he wasn’t the single point.
We had a Chevrolet branded “Nova” which was a Toyota Corolla with different interior and badging and completely Toyota under the stickers and such. My wife bought it in 1987 and we sold it to neighbors in 2006. It only had 87K miles on it but it was hardly a rust bucket. Janet much prefers her current ride in the Caravan. It’s a lot more comfortable for our family and she feels a lot safer in it. I’m trying to take as good a care of the van as Janet did of the Nova. If I do we may keep it that long if we can economically afford the gas for it that long.
Listen, Penske did’t even have enough resources to save little ‘ol Saturn. He’s probably great at running dealerships and truck rentals however. As for Lee’s personality,”Who Cares?” everyone has some traits or attitudes no one else likes. Its called life. Its a big part of working. Its called interoffice politics. It happens in every workplace and office. You need to get past that. You seem to want to be digging up the “dirt” on everyone. What are you a retired tabloid reporter? I hear Elvis is still alive! You know everyperson is human, they have to live their lives, and do what they have to do. No one is perfect fella! I think we could substitute Lee’s name for anyone and you’d have the same response.
MOPAR to ya!
One another note, congrats to Allpar for having no less than 5 articles referenced on the Dodge.com website.
As for Lee Iacacco, the bottom line is, people remember HIM, not necessarliy the team behind him. He was the face out front. Name me one CEO that doesn’t have a big ego? Even the “Aw shucks” ones are just masking their oversized egos and ambitions. They didn’t get to where they are without running over a few people or taking credit for something they didn’t do. They all have their flaws. Name me one that can’t have his or her strengths also characterized as a weakness or personality flaw? It just depends on your perspective.
For me, Lee was/is a hero. The guy that came along at the right time and took what was handed to him and made it successful. All the people in the background may have set the table for him, but it was Lee and his drive and personality that packaged it all and delivered the results. K-cars were almost three decades ago, but people still remember Lee saying: “If you can find a better car, buy it”. Google that and see who’s name comes up. He made a lot of people believers and breathed life back into a company that people though was history. Did he make some bad decisions? They all do. Can anyone here claim that all the decisions they’ve made have been 100% right? 80% right? He was the right man for the times.
None so blind as those who will not see. And no need to crack wise there, Mr. Hemihead. I forgot more about Chrysler than you will ever know, sir. All for discussion. That you believe your opinion is the ONLY opinion that counts is obvious. That you can’t handle a bit of history that flies in the face of your concepts is also obvious. Too bad because a good discussion makes for an interesting read, but that you feel like your opinion is slighted is not the reason nor rationale for discussion. You make it sound like YOUR opinion is all that matters. And to be perfectly frank, I do resent, very much, you, trying to dispense some sort of life advice when it is not the means nor the way of the opinion. It is an OPINION, a discussion of some parts of HISTORY based upon a tongue in cheek comment, which happens to be based upon HISTORICALLY DOCUMENTED FACTS. As you say, MOPAR to YA!
As I said, I didn’t want to appear to engage in a match. However, it has become obvious that somehow you view a counter opinion as some sort of challenge. Nothing could be further from that.
As for my writing, take a bit of time and look around ALLPAR instead of being ready to jump up on someone else. You might find some interesting contributions in my name. Have a great day.
Your a class act Mr. Redgap.
You may well know more about Chrysler than I ever will but, I can guarantee you one thing, you’ll never tarnish, taint, or curb my enthusiasim for this company or
the excitment they have given me thru out the years. I’m hardcore Mopar.
And as they say, “Never Back Down!”
Hemi, I never intended any of my commentary to curb, fade, tarnish, perish, or taint anyone’s enthusiasm for all things Chrysler. You have no idea how I fervently hope and pray that the new alliance with FIAT will be the ONE that makes things work again. Truly, I do. All I do is try to remind folks of history. History, unfortunately, does not enjoy the place that it should. As it is often said, “those that do not heed their history, are doomed to repeat it.” Perish that thought about Chrysler in this day and age! I don’t expect you or anyone to back down. Just be aware that there are other things going on other than what might have influenced one to the place that they hold to be unshakable.
I have owned Chrysler products, (more Plymouth cars than I care to admit) and have not been without a Chrysler product my entire life, including currently, my wife’s Town and Country Van, and my great little PT Cruiser. I can not bring myself to have to try to imagine having anything else! I never bothered to take count of the number of MoPars I have had, my grandpa had, my Dad had, and my brother, cousins and all the other relatives have owned over the years. Some time I will have to try to remember the count, just for the heck of it.
Never back down, as it were. If Marchionne is another Iaccoca, then we are in for a good ride. I agree.
Have to wonder though, about Penske in his bid to get Saturn. If he were going to get Saturn, why wasn’t he going to secure the manufacturing facility as well? Maybe someone will explain that. Unless GM didn’t want anyone to obtain the facility. Does that make sense? I don’t think it was his failure, but more the falling through of Renault to refuse to make the cars. Really is too bad, we don’t need another shuttered manufacturing facility in this country. We have way too many plants that are closed as it is! Saturn makes a good car, have to admit it.
Touche, Mr. Redgap. You are indeed an gentleman.
Sorry if I made you feel defensive. You have contributed alot to this site.
Thanks.
I think there are definately something/someone behind Mr.Penske’s change of mind.
After reading the WSJ’s accounting of Marchionne’s plans for Chrysler, I’m feeling a little uneasy. Having the PT die probably makes sense. I am a little nervous about the Avenger/Sebring being replaced with something based off a FIAT. Hopefully whatever fills the gap left by the departure of the Caliber/Compass/Patriot will be more fuel efficient if nothing else.
The really scary thing is dropping the Caravan. Sure, it makes sense when most dealers will be selling the T&C as well. Why have two minivans, right? However, I worry about what happens to all those Caravan buyers. Will they migrate to the T&C, or will a bunch of them depart for other manufacturers like those old Plymouth Voyager customers did? Seems awfully risky to me.
The other rumor (or is it fact now) that Dodge trucks will become the Ram brand, is a marketing fiasco in the making, IMO. Why flush all those decades of Dodge truck heritage down the drain? Because that’s what they’re doing. I’m not sure I want a “Ram”, but I do know what a “Dodge” is. Apparently nobody has learned a thing from killing off Plymouth.
I agree. They’ve sold 64,000 Caravans this year, vs 61,000 Town & Country. I suspect many of those buyers could be lost to Honda Odessey, Ford Grand C-Max, or a host of CUV’s. Of course, this may just be rumor at this point as Fiat’s plan has not been formally released.
The reports suggest trucks will be in the “Dodge RAM” brand. They’ll still be “Dodge’s.” It’ll be somewhat akin to the days when there was “Dodge” and “Dodge Trucks.” At least that’s the way I interpret what’s been said.
It has created a fair amount of confusion. I wonder if the money needed to create new logos for the “Dodge” cars, new signage, new marketing to introduce people to “Dodge” cars with a new logo, etc is worth it, why it’s necessary to separate the two when Toyota, Ford, Chevrolet all maintain the same symbols and can market cars and trucks within the same “divisions.” Already, TV ads are deleting the Ram symbol in Dodge car ads. Time will tell how this works.
I think it will be suicide to drop the Caravan name. The name “Caravan” is synonomous with minivan.
I don’t know why they would even consider tossing it. Whay not call them Chrysler Caravan or Grand Caravan? Town and Country sounds like a Yuppie vehicle or a vehicle for retirees. Not that there’s anything wrong with that, but the name doesn’t seem appealing to a young family.
I am due for a new minivan in 2011, but they better be priced more in the range of the Caravan, because I won’t be paying extra for the Town & Country.
We don’t really know what is going to happen until the actual news is released, and I don’t know
how correct WSJ usually is, so I guess we’ll have to wait and see.
Chryco fan, I’m interpreting the truck branding as an outright change to the “RAM”-only branding. If it’s going to be “Dodge RAM”, well, they really started that back in the 1980 model year. I don’t see that as much of a change. I guess we’ll have to wait and see what really happens. I don’t see dropping the ram’s head off the cars as that big a deal if they want to reserve it for DODGE RAM trucks.
I also think Chrysler has another opportunity here, and that’s expanding their medium-duty truck line-up. Ford has backed away from that market, and the bankruptcy over at GM killed off their Kodiak/TopKick 4500/5500’s. Have we lost THAT entire market to the foreign competition? Gosh, I hope not. I also heard that Navistar may be coming up with some smaller models to fill that void. Otherwise, the Japanese and the Europeans have pushed us out of our own market. How embarassing is that? And if Chrysler jumps in, it’ll probably be with rebadged European models from FIAT/IVECO. Sad.
Chrysler was reportedly starting to dominate that category and Ford might have pulled a Crown Victoria there. Ditto GM. The new emissions rules coupled with the loss of Isuzu probably hurt GM’s ability to put out something good there in the long term.
i think Plymouth should come back and be the car company that has everything, since Dodge has just muscle and truck. Chrysler should be the high end cars and Fiat and Alfa Romeo should both be the same. Plymouth would fit in perfectly.
Jeep would stay the way it is.
Keep in mind that in Mexico they still build Dodge D500,D600,D700 and D800 under 5000,6000,7000,8000. So they just need a few “politicly correct safety feature” to be sold across north america.So that medium duty segment is already in production.They have Ramcharger based on the 94 up Ram 1500 style.
Anyway I believe that Iaccoca did what he had to do when he got there. Maybe just before Bob Lutz there was a “struggle” but then when Lutz took over you could see that these guys were car enthusiast!! They made things for the fun of it because they could.Chrysler all of a sudden had a soul like the old muscle car era.That passion brings people in the showroom cause thay feel they “make one” with he car.I might be too passionate instead of practical.
I feel now we have a big lack of advertising. I quite pissed when I see others advertising and bragging about features that are in Chrysler products already. Since we don’t advertise much,it seems people thinks that Chrysler is not technically advanced.That looks bad anyway.
Marc,Estevan,SK,Canada aka Valiantlord
Marc, I think you may be mistaken about Dodge building anything larger than the current Ram 5500. If I recall, the Daimler guys killed off the Ram 6500/7000 because it was direct competition to the Mercedes and Freightliner trucks they already sold in Mexico. You’ll still the Ram 6500’s and 7000’s running around Mexico delivering Corona and Coca Cola, but those are getting old and that’s the last of them. The 1999-2001 2WD Ramchargers are not likely to be repeated either.
Here’s some pics of Ram 6500’s in Mexico at this URL. You’ll have to scroll down a bit.
http://www.hankstruckpictures.com/forum01/index.php?topic=3268.15
Here’s another few shots of Mexican Rams. I wonder if we’ll ever see anything like them here in the U.S.? Or just IVECO’s with Ram crosshair grilles?
http://dodgeram.org/ki4cy/ram_picts/Mexram.htm
Just great already have 3 Lebaron’s to contend with and the New York/Dynasty New Yorker Landau’s
try to explain to a customer the difference and the need for a VIN to look up a part. Then throw
in the Chrysler TC, and if your not into MOPARS you have fellow employee’s scratching their heads on what the heck is this, when they get all the parts wrong.
As long as they don’t give all the cars the same name.
I’m thinking Chrysler 300 NEWPORT IMPERIAL CUDA,
Yes that would be one car
Remember, they already did the Dodge Charger R/T Daytona Hemi. For real. And the Dodge Ram Super Bee (gee, I didn’t know the Ram was a B-body.)
Chrysler won’t bring back those names but I wonder if we’ll see the Chrysler Valiant again.
I’m thinking Dodge 500, the Fiat Panda could be rebaged as the Rampage, they could even bring
back Omni, Duster, ah yes I know Cordoba with is fine Corithian leather.
could there be a possible Plymouth comeback soon….
I’m sad you tell me those Medium duty trucks have been killed by Daimler.I saw some odd ones on the net but I thought they were still alive. Anyway,all they did was to suck the best of Chrysler and flush it.Luckyly they did not destroy the soul completely.The cars and trucks developed under Daimler still deserve a star !! A Pentastar.
Thanks for your update.Marc.
Marc, yeah it was sad what Daimler did to Chrysler. We did get some pretty good LX’s out of the deal though. And they were smart enough not to screw up the pickups. I was really hoping they’d replace the Sebring/Stratus with a Mercedes C-class derivative much like the VW Passat is a less expensive Audi A4. Instead we got something else, still better than what they replaced, but not quite good enough. Somehow I think they could’ve taken a $40K C-class amd come up with something that fit in the $20-30K range. Oh well, that’s the past. Here’s to the future.
Lo and behold, I saw the first Dodge Ram television advertisement I’ve seen in months on a cable channel. Other than it had a “Hemi,” there wasn’t any tech-talk, just a mention of twenty miles per gallon and an emphasis ad on toughness with a Ram 1500 in the dirt. I wish they’d do a better job of selling points, but it was better than no ad at all.
Last call for the old agency.
is there any chance that Plymouth could come back as the “everycar” brand???
As much as some of us would like to see Plymouth come back, in the current economic situation, there just isn’t enough money for it to be done. You really would not want it to reincarnate as a “clone” specialty thing, building badge engineered stuff from Dodge and Chrysler or FIAT, unless the Fiat came through as a Plymouth from the start. BUT, it would need a full line up for success, and I do not see that occurring. At least Iaccoca knew enough NOT to kill anything when he came on, and took some pains to insure that Plymouth got its fair share! Further, you need the Plymouth car to be able to have its own stand alone stores, NOT be tied to Dodge, Jeep or Chrysler as a matter of its sales to the public. That was the major issue going into the 50’s and largely what was the beginning of it’s end since K.T. Keller always regarded the Plymouth as “Dodge’s little brother.” He did not have the marketing acumen that WP Chrysler had. Chrysler knew that he had to have Plymouth to make it in the car world, and he built it, and went on to prove the worth of the car. If only his successors had that acumen. L.L. Colbert (Tex) knew the value of Plymouth, as well as did Virgil Exner, both pushing too fast to introduce the 1957 models. Arguably, the Plymouth for 1957 had received the MOST attention. Colbert should have listened to Engineering, and waited for another year to give them time to work out the terrible short comings of the ‘57 models. Give them credit, the ‘58 models were greatly improved quality wise, but the damage had been done, especially for Plymouth. My first “road” car was a ‘58 Plymouth Belvedere, in a story that has been told in this web site. I still recall that car fondly, and wish I had it today!
I guess we’ll have to wait until tomorrow’s official release of information, but the Wall Street Journal’s report and ensuing rumors are making me very uneasy and I’m starting to feel the pall of pessimism set in. If the rumors are true it will appear that the sacking of a once great, iconic American automotive brand will continue. The rape of Chrysler by Daimler, then the languishing by Cerberus, and what may turn out to be the hollowing out by Fiat, should be recorded among the most cold-blooded corporate stories of all time.
It would make sense that a Fiat in control of a major American automotive manufacturing center would desire the advancement of Fiat at the expense of the former. I sense that the direction might be to build up Fiat in North America and let Chrysler eventually fade.
I suppose one cannot blame Marcionne for thinking like a European. Perhaps an American would do the same thing if the situation was reversed. The rumor that LX will be taken over by Fiat is disheartening. But it is very sad that the decision of just a few men, especially Robert Eaton, could have such a debilitating effect on the lives of thousands and the destruction of a once thriving and brilliant company. Steve Rattner’s recent disclosure that the government was quite prepared to let Ford and GM have Chrysler’s former customers by refusing the same assistance to Chrysler that it was promising to other companies, was an appalling display of governmental arrogance as I’ve ever witnessed. Only the negative effects on upwards of 300,000 workers, once belatedly realized, kept the government from participating in the instant death of Chrysler.
Maybe the circulating rumors only represent the worst of the oncoming message, and that the good stuff, if any really exists, is to be forthcoming in the official announcement. Maybe. But just as I now view Eaton’s original decision that Chrysler needed a partner in 1997 as gross ineptness, I’m even more convinced that any arrangement with another auto company in the future will be prone to work against Chrysler.
Cross your fingers, my friends.
If Fiat wants to gain some ground in America gain, then Sergio should bring Plymouth into the fray as an intermediate brand between Fiat, Alfa Romeo, and Lancia. Plymouth could be the sticky stuff that holds everything together, like it did in the 30’s during the Great Depression. Plymouth would bring the spark back into Chrysler that it has been missing since it has been gone.
“Have to wonder though, about Penske in his bid to get Saturn. If he were going to get Saturn, why wasn’t he going to secure the manufacturing facility as well? Maybe someone will explain that. Unless GM didn’t want anyone to obtain the facility. Does that make sense? I don’t think it was his failure, but more the falling through of Renault to refuse to make the cars. Really is too bad, we don’t need another shuttered manufacturing facility in this country. We have way too many plants that are closed as it is! Saturn makes a good car, have to admit it.”
Saturn has no “manufacturing facilities”. Whatsoever. It was folded into GM as a bog standard division, with the first US use of the Delta I in the Ion (and I think the Ecotech family of 4 bangers). Saturn’s old Springfield, TN plant was making some CUV or another, and will probably be shuttered as TN would not pay GM millions of dollars in bribe money. However, it was fully owned by GM, and not Saturn.
Penske was buying the dealership body and name, which was and is outstanding in all respects, and a limited number of years of vehicles from GM until he had replacements (3 IIRC). However, he could not find anyone who had US-ready cars that could be ready in time, and would sell him any as it would be competing against themselves.
It would have taken far too long to develop a entirely new car chassis, engine, drivetrain, etc.., certify it, crash test it, buy and tool a plant, staff said plant, manufacture, and then market the car. 3-5 years at least, with investments of 20-25 BILLION dollars. And it would probably have cost so much that Saturn would be basically as it was in the beginning; a decent car, but no money to update it and make it competitive. Except there would have been no GM to fold back into further on up the road.
I don’t blame Renault for not going through; they are partnered with Nissan, and thus would have been competing against themselves. It would have been Saturn Versa vs Nissan Versa, Saturn Sentra vs Nissan Sentra, etc…