AF: 2018 Chrysler 300 Changes... | Page 36 | Allpar Forums
  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

2018 Chrysler 300 Changes...

Discussion in 'Mopar / FCA News' started by Mike V., Jun 8, 2017.

  1. BobbiBigWheels

    BobbiBigWheels The "Front-Line" Perspective

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2016
    Messages:
    3,245
    Likes:
    4,876
    Us Canadians are ready for the Journey to be put to pasture, but I wouldn't mind another decade of Grand Caravan tbh.
     
  2. Chase300

    Chase300 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2012
    Messages:
    1,699
    Likes:
    1,619
    I do have a question on the current 300...does it have the updated Pentastar? Or the old 1st gen version?
     
  3. redriderbob

    redriderbob Mopar Guru!
    Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2004
    Messages:
    12,761
    Likes:
    23,186
    Yes.

    upload_2018-3-2_19-53-27.png

    upload_2018-3-2_19-54-13.png

    upload_2018-3-2_19-57-22.png

    upload_2018-3-2_19-58-12.png
     
  4. redriderbob

    redriderbob Mopar Guru!
    Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2004
    Messages:
    12,761
    Likes:
    23,186
    Currently there are 181 new 2018 Chrysler 300s with HEMIs on Cars.com for sale. 3,783 new 2018 Chrysler 300s with Pentastar power are sale on there as well. So you can see where the intake of what dealers order for inventory. 1,358 new 2018 Chrysler 300s on there are AWD. Interesting to think about.

    Just for reference, there are currently 17,090 new 2018 Dodge Chargers on Cars.com, and 4,938 of them are HEMI powered cars. 3,514 of those new 2018 Dodge Chargers are AWD.

    As for Chrysler not advertising the 300 as much as they should... you should look at their social media accounts. Where Chrysler Pacifica gets most of the TV time, 300 dominates their social media accounts.

    upload_2018-3-2_21-3-14.png

    They post a lot more about the Chrysler 300 then they do the Pacifica on Facebook...

    upload_2018-3-2_21-5-4.png

    On instagram...

    upload_2018-3-2_21-7-8.png

    As you can see from twitter, the same goes for it as well...
     
    HotCarNut likes this.
  5. redriderbob

    redriderbob Mopar Guru!
    Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2004
    Messages:
    12,761
    Likes:
    23,186
    It's true...

    A mainstream brand that won't be like the mainstream
    "You have 290 different vehicles to choose from in the marketplace, sold by 40 different brands," Kuniskis said. "It's getting very confusing. People are getting numb to all the choices. They're looking for something that's going to be fun, unique, different."

    That's where Dodge comes in.

    As Kuniskis sees it, car shoppers are faced with a sea of boring choices. He sees a huge opportunity for Dodge to become the not-boring alternative, the brand that offers "mainstream performance."

    That means fire-breathing Hemi V8s, but it also means cars that are fuel-efficient and sensible, even while bringing some of the excitement of their tire-burning siblings.

    For the new Dodge, it all starts with the Charger
    For Kuniskis, this begins with the Dodge Charger.

    The Charger is a full-sized four-door sedan. On paper, it competes with cars such as Toyota's (NYSE:TM) Avalon, Ford's (NYSE:F) Taurus, and General Motors' (NYSE:GM) Chevrolet Impala.

    But in real life, "27% of Charger buyers didn't cross-shop it against anything," Kuniskis said. In other words, they didn't shop around: They wanted a Charger, and that's what they bought.

    Why? Because the Charger isn't like an Avalon or an Impala.

    Sure, you can get a Charger with a fuel-efficient V6 engine backed by a high-tech eight-speed transmission, a combination that gets an EPA-rated 19 miles per gallon in the city, 31 highway -- right in the same ballpark as the V6-powered versions of the Impala and Avalon.

    Equipped that way, it's a roomy and practical four-door sedan.

    But the Charger is also offered with two different Hemi V8s that turn it into a seriously fast high-performance car that also happens to be a roomy and practical four-door sedan.

    Toyota and Ford have nothing like it. And even though the V6 Charger looks a lot like an Avalon on paper, its Hemi-powered siblings give it an image, an appeal, that Toyota can't match.

    That makes it unique. And it works: The Charger's retail sales growth has far outpaced the overall growth of the full-sized car segment over the last five years. It now outsells both the Avalon and the Taurus by wide margins.

    Now Kuniskis wants every Dodge to be the Charger of its segment.

    The Challenger is about a lot more than the Hellcat
    The "halo effect" that sells all those V6 Chargers is what Kuniskis means when he talks about "mainstream performance." Not every Dodge is going to be an expensive high-performance car. But all Dodges will benefit from the excitement of the brand's high-performance image, he thinks.

    Dodge as a brand already does a good job of attracting younger buyers. The average Dodge buyer is 10 years younger than the average Chevy buyer, nine years younger than Ford's, and eight years younger than Toyota's, according to Kuniskis.

    He plans to build on that advantage by using Dodge's standout high-performance models to add excitement to the more practical choices in Dodge's lineup.

    Consider the Charger's sibling, the retro-styled two-door Challenger coupe.

    Lately, the attention-getter for Dodge has been the new 707-horsepower Hellcat version of the refreshed-for-2015 Challenger. It's a monster, with eye-popping acceleration numbers.

    But Kuniskis loves to point to the base-model Challenger, the SXT, which is powered by a 300-horsepower V6.

    Noting that the average "pony car" on the road today is 12 years old, Kuniskis said the V6 Challenger with the eight-speed automatic transmission will outperform a 12-year-old V8-powered Ford Mustang or Chevy Camaro -- while getting 30 miles per gallon on the highway.

    And he noted that the Challenger is almost as practical as a mainstream four-door sedan. Sure, it's a two-door, but it's a big two-door, with a back seat that is comfortable for adults.

    As Kuniskis tells it, that makes it an intriguing alternative to something like a Toyota Camry. He thinks more buyers -- particularly younger ones -- will be looking for "fun, unique, different" alternatives to cars like the Camry over the next several years.

    How the rest of Dodge will become a "performance" brand
    So how does this idea fit with the rest of Dodge's lineup?

    In some places, Kuniskis said, it fits just fine. The handsome Durango crossover "is already the Charger of its segment," according to the CEO, thanks to the vehicle's rugged good looks and its available Hemi V8.

    But some Dodges will need work: The compact Dart will get a stylistic makeover and a performance bump when it is refreshed in 2016, he said, while a new compact crossover that reflects Dodge's updated brand values will replace the Journey at about the same time. Both will be available in turbocharged high-performance versions.

    And, of course, the rental-darling midsize Avenger sedan is already gone, and the iconic Grand Caravan minivan will be discontinued soon.

    Those decisions make sense when you consider that Dodges are sold in showrooms that also offer Chrysler, Jeep, and Ram vehicles.

    Under the new plan, Chrysler will sell the minivans and mainstream sedans, while Jeep has the trail-ready SUVs and Ram offers the pickups and commercial vehicles.

    But it's Dodge, with its roaring Hemi V8s -- and its fuel-efficient smaller engines -- that will draw the buyers looking for something different.

    Kuniskis said he thinks there will be an increasing number of those buyers in the years to come, and he plans to have just what they're looking for.

    Why the 2015 Dodge Charger Is Key to Fiat Chrysler's Plan (at https://www.fool.com/investing/general/2014/07/29/why-the-2015-dodge-charger-is-key-to-fiat-chrysler.aspx )
     
  6. Chase300

    Chase300 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2012
    Messages:
    1,699
    Likes:
    1,619
    I often pick up clients at the airport and many times without having ever met them before.
    All I tell them is I'm in a black 300...they never ask me..What is that?
     
    UN4GTBL and redriderbob like this.
  7. CivoLee

    CivoLee Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2012
    Messages:
    242
    Likes:
    292
    I think part of the reason why people don't care for Chrysler being reduced to a "mainstream" brand is it takes all the prestige out of the US side of the company and puts it all in Europe. It harks back to the DCX days when Mercedes Benz treated Chrysler like they didn't know what they were doing and only Europeans could build a proper premium car, while the dumb Yanks just throw an engine made of "melted down bridge girders" (to quote Jeremy Clarkson) into a body hammered together, stuff it with couches, put the whole mess on wheels and call it a day.

    Why couldn't Chrysler offer a mainstream car that stands out from the competition style or tech-wise? If they try to out-Civic Honda or out-RAV4 Toyota, they're going to lose, just like every other time they've tried that.
     
    bluskye and randy1911 like this.
  8. redriderbob

    redriderbob Mopar Guru!
    Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2004
    Messages:
    12,761
    Likes:
    23,186
    Good point. But the 300C and the Pacifica Limited show that mainstream doesn't have to just cheap blue collar (Yank) rides...

    Screenshot_20180302-222047.jpg

    Screenshot_20180302-221506.jpg

    Chrysler offers their affordable luxury trims.
     
    UN4GTBL, HotCarNut, somber and 2 others like this.
  9. HotCarNut

    HotCarNut Defender of Reality
    Level III Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2009
    Messages:
    2,911
    Likes:
    2,734
    Renaming the Sebring and cleaning up the styling does not make it “all new” although the refresh WAS incredible. Quite frankly I’m still shocked the 200 didn’t do better.
     
    UN4GTBL likes this.
  10. page2171

    page2171 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2007
    Messages:
    1,646
    Likes:
    2,419
    Did you forget about this 200?

    [​IMG]
     
    freshforged likes this.
  11. randy1911

    randy1911 Active Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2016
    Messages:
    544
    Likes:
    499
    You did not read my original statement, in your response, if you go back you will see that I said the 300 has received a substantial under the skin treatment in 2015.

    The problem is to non enthusiasts it still looks mostly the same. Put a 2014 300S next to a 2015 300S a person like you and me which are enthusiast will see the difference immediately. A person that's shopping may not and probably don't see it at all. But let's look at your chargers compared to the new charger big difference. Which also spark sales when a visual difference happens. I'll give you a great view of how visual change and interior upgrades can spark a vehicle. Look at the last year's lincoln navigator. No one cared, it sold some numbers not enough to be really noticed not making any news in the industry but once was a great name back mid 2000s. Lincoln seen opportunity to completely change the mantra let's do everything we did right in 2003 to 2006 but turn it up. Let's stop adding trims and colors to the same vehicle and expect a huge result. Let's improve the interior let's make the vehicle look like a completely new vehicle let's make it bold and aggressive and see what happens. This is the message chrysler should take and learn from, now lincoln can sell navigators for 5k over msrp they can't make enough because they did the exact thing opposite of what FCA did with a once noble nameplate. Sounds like the 300 of 2005 to me.

    I just wish someone at FCA sometimes took the opinion of non company sheep and wonder why those that have spent money is not happy with the direction of where they taking Chrysler in stead of trying to invent a market that they have no expertise in.
     
    #711 randy1911, Mar 3, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2018
    Erik Latranyi likes this.
  12. 98058

    98058 Guest

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2017
    Messages:
    0
    Likes:
    2
    Your wish has been answered, as Kuniskis is now in a position to make sure that Dodge-Alfa will run the sport side of FCA.

    The mistake you make in trying to sell all that "fools gold" you offered so kindly to RedRiderBob, the mistake is: that you live in the past.

    The position of the Chrysler brand on the Fiat Chrysler corporate umbrella list is just above Lancia.
    (and the important word is Brand as in Chrysler brand, because the car company and all it stood for does not exist any more).

    Therefore the 300 and all that it stands for has been reduced to the same level as the Journey and Grand Caravan: cash cow.

    It will last for as long that FCA thinks it makes any money and that will be that.

    It is what it is.

    And the thing is: the Dodge brand is far more important in the future of FCA than the Chrysler brand.

    Trust Tim Kuniskis is my advice.
     
    GasAxe and DAGAR like this.
  13. mopar22

    mopar22 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2010
    Messages:
    2,757
    Likes:
    2,109
    I think even people in the states are ready but it's the cheapest car that anyone can get approved for for the most part so it will sell till it gets sent off
     
  14. redriderbob

    redriderbob Mopar Guru!
    Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2004
    Messages:
    12,761
    Likes:
    23,186
    Ok? That would like saying a person can't see the different between the 2012 Ram 1500 vs 2013 Ram 1500, yet they both sold hundreds of thousands of them! Goes to show you its not necessarily the product as so much the market for the segment. With the sedan segment shrinking you think FCA US should invest more money into a model that will more than likely disappear in two more model years?

    You're crazy and obviously don't know the first thing of business. If that was presented to the board at FCA, they would simply laugh until you left the room. Every company would in fact.

    As for the 2014 Charger vs the 2015 Charger, the design change was to push the car past the frontal looks which were similar from the 2006-2010 and 2011-2014 models to somewhere with the Dart. Remember the 300 in 2011, looked similar yet drastically different than the 2005-2010 model it replaced.

    Example...

    IMG_20180303_140535.jpg
    Top: 2005 Chrysler 300C, Middle: 2011 Chrysler 300C, Bottom: 2015 Chrysler 300S.

    Quite a change between them. If you recall the 2008 Chrysler 300 got a mild revision with new tail lights and wheels, where the 2015 car got revisited transmissions, styling, interior materials and features. Yet I don't hear complaining about that. But look at the different from the 2005 to 2011 300.

    IMG_20180303_140554.jpg

    Now lets look at Charger. Styling for the front end of the 2011 model year was an evolution from its 2005 counterpart. With Dodge design language changing with vehicles like the Dart it got a styling change.

    So in hindsight you are complaining that the lack of making the 300 drastically different looking is what is settling itself back, you are far mistaken. The market for sedan is shrinking. GM has slowed production of its 300 competitor the Impala as well as the rest of its big car lineup. Ford's 300 competitor the Taurus is selling slow as well to the point they might discontinue it in North America (China would be the only continuing market). You can read more here...

    Ford Considers Killing off Taurus in 2018 (at http://www.thedrive.com/news/12879/ford-considers-killing-off-taurus-in-2018 )


    Ford's Taurus Police Interceptor is being outsold by the Explorer Police Interceptor 7 to 1. Charger is the best selling Police sedan, as well as has someone youngest democraphics at the mean age of 40. That is why it will live on.

    Chrysler tried to build on the Charger's demographic with the 300S. 300S is 50% of 300 sales and the average 300S buyer is 48 years old. That is 8 years older than the average Charger buyer. Also the rest of the full sedan segments mean age for demographics is 61 years old.

    Here is a whole article you can read about Chrysler and the 300 trying to attract youngers...

    Chrysler says 300S lures younger buyers (at https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2015/03/23/chrysler-300-younger-buyers/70345564/ )

    So @randy1911 I have yet to see you provide facts to back up any of your statements.

    If you look at Chrysler 300 sales since 2005. 300 was hot pushing over 130k to 150k in sedans for the 2005 to 2007 model year in the US and Canada. In 2008, sales began to slow way down and that was the introduction of new trims and minor update to 70k. 2009 to 2011 were the worst years for the 300 with only 39k to 42k units sold. The 2011 refresh didn't seem to pickup sales until 2012, selling 76k units in US and Canada. 2013 to the Present the car stays steady with 55k to 62k with numbers decreasing from 2013.

    For the past eight years, Charger has been selling steadily in the high-90k units for the US and Canada. That only includes civilian models, since law enforcement numbers aren't included in the public sale numbers.

    So again you have a car that sales are descreasing on which will probably end production in two model years and one that sells steady for the past decade with double the sales numbers. That doesn't include the thousands you sell to law enforcement. Which would you investment more into?
     
    GasAxe, HotCarNut and Ryan like this.
  15. BobbiBigWheels

    BobbiBigWheels The "Front-Line" Perspective

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2016
    Messages:
    3,245
    Likes:
    4,876
    I for one was really happy that the 2011 300 stopped looking like a Bentley... tbh.
     
    UN4GTBL and Christopher like this.
  16. randy1911

    randy1911 Active Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2016
    Messages:
    544
    Likes:
    499
    Yes you hit it on the head with two of your points and I will elaborate. In your post you stated that
    "

    Chrysler tried to build on the Charger's demographic with the 300S. 300S is 50% of 300 sales and the average 300S buyer is 48 years old. That is 8 years older than the average Charger buyer. Also the rest of the full sedan segments mean age for demographics is 61 years old.

    That's the thing right there FCA did a halfa## job they gave the 300s which led to half the 300 being s versions but they did not provide the engines or the trims to match. (Please don't say srt appearance it's just plastic with no substance) Knowing alot of salesmen and dealerships, people go into the dealer wanting a scat pack or an srt or even a hellcat charger, once they get there alot of people find out they can only afford a RT or Sxt it still produces sales and it stays relevant in the media. The 300 has a S and a C but people go into the dealership as FCA has figured out wanting mostly an S what what would happen if the engines along with exotic trims and special old versions like a 300m special edition just like a Charger daytona. People would go into dealerships wanting those higher end 300s ever ones talking about just like the chargers but getting a regular 300 or limited. What would happen if Chrysler did more than half the job of just giving it a S version and gave it others?

    Second thing you stated was Chevy, Ford and other reducing the sedan production due to changing market. The 300 has always been a top 3 sedan after the cheaper charger always, Chevy and Ford reducing their sedan production will help 300 sales not hurt. You want proof here u go, Point of reference let's look at cadillac the xts for example its the large sedan as you know, what are those sales doing once the refresh happend it increased... Oh my goodness a large sedan increased sales in a shrinking sedan market. Yes why because it was refreshed not from the inside but 95 percent on the outside visually. On the inside its 98 percent the same car sold in 2013 as sold 2018 but the sales increased because visually the refresh looks different. No not in a super shrinking market yes in a super shrinking market a sedan that has been the same since 2013 mechanically is selling more why the appearance.

    I already understand the 300's fate is what it is but I still believe that FCA failed the 300 and not the market fault as they would like to believe. It was the leave it on a vine to do what ever it can that put it in the current position its in and it still won 2 awards in the past year, so again its all FCA. Even if you don't agree, the cadillac example backs my argument of a large sedan gaining sales in a shrinking market if it's given the correct tlc and not a life support diagnosis. Look at the past January sales of the xts vs a year ago that's as recent as u can can get what happen an increase but an xts is not a suv or cuv but it increased.
     
  17. Mike V.

    Mike V. Mopar-nac The Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2008
    Messages:
    26,427
    Likes:
    22,138
    Gentlemen, have we...

    A5BAB8AC-DE4D-4747-9BD7-15685AFC7F38.gif

    Enough yet?

    Mike
     
    UN4GTBL, MoparJoe, HotCarNut and 3 others like this.
  18. Ryan

    Ryan Moderator
    Staff Member Level III Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2016
    Messages:
    6,735
    Likes:
    11,766
    I’d be willing to bet that almost everyone who isn’t a car enthusiast can’t tell the difference in the XTS before and after its refresh. Oh, and the XTS is being discontinued too!
     
    danbek and freshforged like this.
  19. redriderbob

    redriderbob Mopar Guru!
    Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2004
    Messages:
    12,761
    Likes:
    23,186
    It did, until Sergio bashed it and announced it was being axed.
     
    UN4GTBL and HotCarNut like this.
  20. Terrymc1

    Terrymc1 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2017
    Messages:
    98
    Likes:
    211
    Note: This is not a political announcement or judgement of any kind, just an observation. If the recently talked about tariffs on imported steel and aluminum come to fruition and especially if combined with the most recent mention of new tariffs on European vehicles things might change. Not too long ago expensive gas drove people out of their SUVs and trucks and back to traditional cars. If the cost of materials to build those behemoths increases it will be reflected as increased cost to the consumer. Depending on how expensive they get traditional sedans such as the 300 may become a more attractive alternative.
     

Share This Page

Loading...
 We are not affiliated with FCA. We make no claims regarding validity or accuracy of information or advice. Copyright © VerticalScope Inc. All rights reserved.