Hello, Allpar Forums member or visitor! If you were a member, you would not see this ad!

Register or log in at the top right of the page...

  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Chrysler in Off-road series

Discussion in 'Historical' started by Beentherebefore, Nov 30, 2013.

  1. Beentherebefore

    Level III Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2012
    Messages:
    4,237
    Likes:
    1,359
    Effective advertising and marketing has been brought up multiple times - and so has ineffective and misplaced marketing, particularly by Chrysler recently. My personal opinion is that Superbowl fans are intensely interested in the football game and little else unless the commercials are exceptional. As a motorsports fan, I can tell you that I get extremely annoyed when other sports are advertised when I'm watching an auto racing event. Motorsports advertising, however, will get at least some attention from me. The Infiniti ad with the F-1 cars, for example, I thought was excellent, and it often ran during Nascar races, at least in this area. People still comment about those great "Hey Jeremy" ads (where Mayfield's date takes a bath in trans fluid to smell right for him) that Chrysler ran back in '03 and '04. Of course, for those ads to be effective, you have to be supporting motorsports programs. If you just want to be known as the "minivan company", well then just about anywhere will get you as much attention as anywhere else (very little) but, imo, it is the height of stupidity to support a race series with your advertising when your main market competitors are featured in the racing and you have ZERO presence in the series.
     
  2. MoparNorm

    MoparNorm Active Jeeper
    Level III Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2008
    Messages:
    31,153
    Likes:
    7,679
    The Ultra 4 "Mopar Spec" Series is using identically prepared chassis and 5.7 crate Hemi's.
    All engines, transmissions and transfer cases are sealed and all cars are on lease.
    At $10,000 per race it's an economical way for someone to buy into the series.
     
  3. Beentherebefore

    Level III Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2012
    Messages:
    4,237
    Likes:
    1,359
    OK, I'm for anything that will get HP development of the Gen III Hemi going.This should be good for endurance testing, if nothing else. Keep us all informed. I'm assuming this will be in the current racing threads, not historical. Maybe you can post some pictures/videos when the (cars?) get out into action. I'm interested in how "stock" they will be in appearance.
     
  4. Beentherebefore

    Level III Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2012
    Messages:
    4,237
    Likes:
    1,359
    Great photo of a Walker Evans truck in action.

    Photo came off a net wallpaper site which said to feel free to download it, so........




    [​IMG]
     
  5. MoparNorm

    MoparNorm Active Jeeper
    Level III Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2008
    Messages:
    31,153
    Likes:
    7,679
    I'll be too busy running my team, but Allpar Reporter, Ray Alexander will be there and Im sure he will report upon that and I'll relay those comments to Ray!
    Thanks!
     
  6. MoparNorm

    MoparNorm Active Jeeper
    Level III Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2008
    Messages:
    31,153
    Likes:
    7,679
    From a non-Motorsports thread, I thought I'd bring it here:


    Beentherebefore, on 17 Mar 2014 - 04:27 AM, said:
    "It was Walker Evans AND Rod Hall in the 80s racing for Dodge in Off-road series (see the Off-road thread that I started in the historical racing section). "

    My reply:
    Both Evans and Hall, raced Dodge's in the 70's as well. When Mickey Thompson was the SCORE, stadium truck series promoter, I watched them race at Riverside. The place was packed!
    Hall stood out because he was getting the Dodge airborne and flying farther than any competitor, including the buggies! Those trucks were epic.
    There were 16 races held there, I attended the first in 1973.
    Walker Evans started racing in 1969, driving a near stock Jeep Scrambler, in the Baja 500.
     
  7. dyslexic teddybear

    dyslexic teddybear Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    628
    Likes:
    307
    Interesting

    Not a big follower at the time, but I did read a lot of differing mags [killing time at the mag rack].....I remember thinking the "stadium" thing was ridiculous.....why go to all the trouble of filling a stadium with dirt?

    And then I realized it lets a LOT of people get a good view.

    Also remember reading about suspension design in that time frame......IIRC, rear was quarter elliptical.......like 20" of travel.....fascinating to read and try to understand it.....
     
  8. MoparNorm

    MoparNorm Active Jeeper
    Level III Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2008
    Messages:
    31,153
    Likes:
    7,679
    Mr. Walker, as he is called around the pits, had one suspension system which utilized a derrick, or teeter-totter like arm, mounted in the bed of the truck, solidly attached to the axles by supports coming up through the bed. At the back of the cab wall was a rail with all of the shocks, attached to the opposite end of the derrick. When the axle was forced up by an obstacle, it pushed the arm up, which was hinged in the center (hence the teeter-totter reference) the other end moving down, pushed the shocks into compression and vice versa. The theory was any bump moving the axle and truck upward would be reacted by a opposite downforce, kind of like lifting yourself up by your boots.

    Pretty cool in theory, in practice however it did not allow much articulation and it came amid much fanfare and disappeared silently...
    :lol:
     
  9. dyslexic teddybear

    dyslexic teddybear Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    628
    Likes:
    307
    Very interesting design. Just a guess.....trying to get better performance from the available shocks? IIRC, shock tech was very limited back then.

    That time frame in life, rather then just waiting for the[now ex] I would find the nearest library [magazine rack] and read. Really interested in car/race suspensions, so I got a basic understanding.

    I do remember that the quarter elliptical seemed to be huge for the rig. At least compared to a stock spring.
     
  10. MoparNorm

    MoparNorm Active Jeeper
    Level III Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2008
    Messages:
    31,153
    Likes:
    7,679
    Shock technology was not as advanced, but still rather good, for companies like King and Fox, just getting started. Remember the big off road shocks in those days were Gabriel and Rancho. Fox and King, re-wrote the book.
    I would add Bilstein except at that time the largest vehicle they served was VW, IIRC correctly, they may have built their first "heavy" vehicle competition shocks for Walker Evans. I think on the setup I described, there was something like 6 or 8 shocks in the bed.
    I would think the coil-link engineering performed by Bob Sheaves, for Dodge and Jeep (and earlier, suspension work on the IH Scout) was the most instrumental in advancing off road suspension design. Both Evans and Hall used the Coil-link and Hall holds records that will likely stand forever.

    Thats's right Bob Sheaves, formerly of Allpar, was a pioneer. Bob would deflect credit to others, but I won't. Too bad a few [this word has been banned due to its use as a pointless flame tool] ruined that experience and educational opportunity for us here.
     
    #30 MoparNorm, Mar 17, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 18, 2014
  11. dyslexic teddybear

    dyslexic teddybear Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    628
    Likes:
    307
    Interesting info, thanks.


    Mr Sheaves left? Only on here a few hours on the weekends and had not heard that. I did see some stuff......there may have been more, but it didn't seem that bad. I may not be a good judge of that, I've got a real thick internet skin.

    That's more then unfortunate. Mr Sheaves is a resource that just should NOT be wasted. I refer to him as Mr, as I had not conversed....I can't call him Bob. He was.....one of those, that when I saw he commented, I'd want to click on it, just to see what he wrote.....even if I wasn't very interested in the original subject.

    That just[expletive deleted]
     
  12. MoparNorm

    MoparNorm Active Jeeper
    Level III Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2008
    Messages:
    31,153
    Likes:
    7,679
    Yes, he is a treasure, as is his knowledge and his articles which were posted here.
     
  13. Beentherebefore

    Level III Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2012
    Messages:
    4,237
    Likes:
    1,359
    I used to read about & see stuff about those races but I wasn't into off-road enough to save much of anything. Those pictures of flying Mopar trucks were really something. Did you save anything from those days that you can post on this thread? Sometimes the old programs had stuff, as did newspaper ads (Riverside Press Entereprise) and track entry handouts.
     
  14. Beentherebefore

    Level III Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2012
    Messages:
    4,237
    Likes:
    1,359
    Some may not know, but Walker Evans tried his hand at racing Dodges in the Nascar Truck series in it's first two years - 1995 & 1996. He never really got the hang of it. He finished 14th in points in 1995 and 17th in points in 1996. He got a few top 10s including a 9th place @ the old Mesa Marin Speedway in Bakersfield, CA. Lance Norick also drove for him in a few of the Nascar truck races. With little support from the factory, Walker was gone from the series by 1997 and I think that was the end of his long relationship with Dodge.
     
  15. dyslexic teddybear

    dyslexic teddybear Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    628
    Likes:
    307
    [sigh] Kinda forgotten about that......another instance of a long time supporter......seemingly cut off.

    Not surprising he didn't get the hang of pavement very quick. But you'd think he would have been in a good position to be a team owner, thus deserving support.

    Perhaps a another missed opportunity.
     
  16. MoparNorm

    MoparNorm Active Jeeper
    Level III Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2008
    Messages:
    31,153
    Likes:
    7,679
    Evans only raced in several seasons, as a driver, then became a team owner.
    He continued his Walker Evans Racing team after his retirement as a driver. He hired former SODA and CORR competitor Brendan Gaughan to race for him in 2002. .( In 2003, racing for his farther, Gaughan was the CTS points leader going into the final race, but was crashed out, on the final lap a mealy resulted in next Musgrave being penalized and then Setzer, costing Dodge a Championship and Manufacturers title.)

    Edited to correct some poor information from wiki. ;)
     
  17. md80891

    md80891 Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2014
    Messages:
    2,404
    Likes:
    456
    I think I am going to cry.
     
  18. md80891

    md80891 Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2014
    Messages:
    2,404
    Likes:
    456
    In those days like up in post 3 I used to wait for 4wd to post the race results and reviews. Hall and Walker were unbeatable. Then they changed the rules for Toyota. It would be interesting to find the WWS video of the east african road rally, Hall ran a RamCharger there or a Trailduster.

    Yes we need to Run Daklar, Robby is the driver to do it, the problem is replacing the LS7. It could be reskinned as a GC . The minis are prepped by Raid in Germany and as awd vehicles are limited to 10" of travel. As diesels they can be turbocharged but the limit is 3.0 liters. No induction on anything bigger than that. So if you did a renegade you could run a diesel but you could only run ten inches of travel.

    But you could make a run of it with GC 'Gordini" Sainz in a buggy, ? in a renegade and team up with the Iveco guys for support (though I would prefer Sisu) And I think we should send Norm. we have to start this afternoon.
     
  19. Beentherebefore

    Level III Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2012
    Messages:
    4,237
    Likes:
    1,359
    Yeah, that was a bitter pill. IIRC, it was a Jim Smith truck that knocked Gaughan out of the race (and the championship) but it wasn't Musgrave driving it. Jim Smith brought in a wringer (??) who lost control of the truck and ran Gaughan into the wall.

    I guess we're going to need to start a historical thread for the Nascar Truck series since this one is intended for off-road. Mopars ruled in that series for several years. Seems like an eternity now.
     
  20. Beentherebefore

    Level III Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2012
    Messages:
    4,237
    Likes:
    1,359
    And............while not participating in NASCAR in the 80s, the company took pride in participating in major off-road series and didn't hesitate to market the acomplishments of Walker Evans and Rod Hall. Found this ad being offered for sale on e-Bay


    [​IMG]
     

Share This Page

Loading...