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Civil COVID-19 Discussion

Discussion in 'Off Topic But Still Civil' started by Ryan, Apr 23, 2020.

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  1. Doug D

    Doug D Virginia Gentleman

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    Carter is a good man, but his time as president not so much.

    I admire him for what he has done after he left office.
     
    aldo90731, tomit and 06PTElectricBlue like this.
  2. Doug D

    Doug D Virginia Gentleman

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    IMHO as president he had the ultimate acting job.
     
    Tony K likes this.
  3. 06PTElectricBlue

    06PTElectricBlue Active Member

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    Maybe President Reagan was likeable as a President, because he was an actor. :)

    Then there may be some acting like a President, but they may not be likeable. ;)
     
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  4. 77 Monaco Brougham

    77 Monaco Brougham Well-Known Member

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    You said it, Brother!

    What a @#$%^& non-choice we're being presented with in November...

    One person (name unmentioned) who suffers from Arrested Development, Narcissistic Personality Disorder, and Megalomania.

    Another person (name unmentioned) very clearly suffering the early stages of Dementia.

    Sweet Jusus!!!:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:
     
  5. Zagnut27

    Zagnut27 Jeepaholic

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    I think there should be an age limit for running for President. No offense to anyone here who might be of a similar age, but the job of President will grind you down and age you much quicker than normal. As evidenced by the before and after pics. Starting at an advanced age gives you little wiggle room.
     
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  6. 06PTElectricBlue

    06PTElectricBlue Active Member

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    Chronological, biological or mental age :rolleyes: (some adults can act like a spoiled child) :p

    Another requirement to be an effective Commander In Chief should be prior Military service. After all, how better to lead your troops, unless you are one of them. ;)

    Presidents with prior Military service:

    List of presidents of the United States by military service - Wikipedia (at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_presidents_of_the_United_States_by_military_service )

    Donald Trump - none
    Barack Obama - none
    George W. Bush - Texas National Guard
    Bill Clinton - none
    George H.W. Bush - United States Naval Reserve
    Ronald Reagan - United States Army Reserve, United States Army Air Forces
    Jimmy Carter - United States Navy
    Gerald Ford - United States Naval Reserve
    Richard Nixon - United States Naval Reserve
    Lyndon B. Johnson - United States Naval Reserve
    John F. Kennedy - United States Naval Reserve
    Dwight D. Eisenhower - United States Army
    Harry S. Truman - Missouri Army National Guard, United States Army, United States Army Reserve
    Franklin D. Roosevelt - none
    Herbert Hoover - none
    Calvin Coolidge - none
    Warren G. Harding - none
    Woodrow Wilson - none
    William Howard Taft - Connecticut Home Guard
    Theodore Roosevelt - United States Army
    William McKinley - United States Army
    Grover Cleveland - none
    Benjamin Harrison - United States Army
    Grover Cleveland - none
    Chester A. Arthur - New York State Militia
    James A. Garfield - United States Army
    Rutherford B. Hayes - United States Army
    Ulysses S. Grant - United States Army
    Andrew Johnson - United States Army
    Abraham Lincoln - Illinois State Militia
    James Buchanan - Pennsylvania State Militia
    Franklin Pierce - United States Army
    Millard Fillmore - New York State Militia
    Zachary Taylor - United Stated Army
    James K. Polk - Tennessee State Militia
    John Tyler - Virginia Militia
    William Henry Harrison - United States Army
    Martin Van Buren - none
    Andrew Jackson - Tennessee State Militia, Continental Army, United States Army
    John Quincy Adams - none
    James Monroe - Continental Army
    James Madison - Virginia Militia
    Thomas Jefferson - Virginia Militia
    John Adams - none
    George Washington - Virginia Militia, Continental Army, United States Army

    Those that have served know that the Military can build character, instill discipline and teach someone how to work and get along with others, especially when your life may depend on them, and they are depending on you for their life. ;)
     
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  7. tomit

    tomit Well-Known Member

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    What a @#$%^& non-choice we're being presented with in November...
    One person (name unmentioned) who suffers from Arrested Development, Narcissistic Personality Disorder, and Megalomania.


    I for one don't view the president as my 'daddy'. More important to me than 'optics' is what the administration accomplishes. Am I 100% happy with what the current guy has accomplished? Sadly no, but I am way more satisfied with what has been done so far compared to any of the past 4 presidents.
     
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  8. DC-93

    DC-93 Well-Known Member

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    Another requirement should be I.Q.
    tests for voters.

    :cool:
     
  9. Doug D

    Doug D Virginia Gentleman

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    Indeed. Carter did not age well during his term.
     
  10. Zagnut27

    Zagnut27 Jeepaholic

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    Reagan most likely was suffering from the early stages of Alzheimer’s, and would reportedly fall asleep during meetings. Bush senior wasn’t in office long enough. Look at Clinton and Bush Jr after they left office, quite a difference. Obama aged pretty well, but he always looked young to begin with.
     
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  11. Zagnut27

    Zagnut27 Jeepaholic

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    I think the electoral college was supposed to help to prevent the great unwashed masses electing an unfit president. “Supposed to”.
     
  12. 06PTElectricBlue

    06PTElectricBlue Active Member

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    Maybe he didn't age well in office, but maybe that experience made him stronger as today him and Rosalynn are still going strong and helping so many people with their Habitat For Humanity projects, which certainly has to be very physically demanding. :)

    I can't envision Trump out there on a construction site throwing a hammer, trying to help others. After all, where was Trump over Memorial Day weekend wen the US marked over 100,000 deaths to the Coronavirus? ;)
     
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  13. patfromigh

    patfromigh Well-Known Member

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    The fact that someone of very low character emerged from the selection process to become president evidences that our process is broken.

    Both parties failed to field a candidate who isn't wedded to special interests.
     
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  14. DC-93

    DC-93 Well-Known Member

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    Golfing again??
     
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  15. Dave Z

    Dave Z It's me, Dave
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    The process is definitely broken. I won't agree that there's no difference between the parties.

    A required veteran status would rule out anyone born with some sort of physical issue — like FDR, possibly our strongest president. Or Thomas Jefferson, one of our most intelligent but most hypocritical. Or John Adams, one of our most honest. Or Bill Clinton, the only one in recent history to get a balanced budget (and don't credit that to others, because it's well documented that he started working on it before he even took office, and kept at it for his full term, while the “budget hawks” in Congress showed zero fiscal discipline when Clinton was gone).

    Reagan was in the military, but he was never overseas or in any danger. He worked as a liaison, and quickly transferred into public relations, where he stayed. That's not a criticism; he had bad eyesight.
     
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  16. 06PTElectricBlue

    06PTElectricBlue Active Member

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    Maybe why the system is broken is just another reason that there should be term limits, for everyone! :)

    It's not just one person that runs everything, but everyone working together. When someone chooses a life of public service, that means that they choose to put others ahead of themselves, instead of what's in it for them and how can they get the most that they can for themselves. ;)
     
    #636 06PTElectricBlue, May 31, 2020
    Last edited: May 31, 2020
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  17. patfromigh

    patfromigh Well-Known Member

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    What follows are some selected paragraphs from an infamous commencement address at Harvard in 1978, by Alexandr Solzhenitsyn.

    A World Split Apart delivered 8 June 1978, Harvard University

    Western society has given itself the organization best suited to its purposes based, I would say, one the letter of the law. The limits of human rights and righteousness are determined by a system of laws; such limits are very broad. People in the West have acquired considerable skill in interpreting and manipulating law. Any conflict is solved according to the letter of the law and this is considered to be the supreme solution. If one is right from a legal point of view, nothing more is required. Nobody will mention that one could still not be entirely right, and urge self-restraint, a willingness to renounce such legal rights, sacrifice and selfless risk. It would sound simply absurd. One almost never sees voluntary self-restraint. Everybody operates at the extreme limit of those legal frames.

    I have spent all my life under a Communist regime and I will tell you that a society without any objective legal scale is a terrible one indeed. But a society with no other scale than the legal one is not quite worthy of man either. A society which is based on the letter of the law and never reaches any higher is taking very scarce advantage of the high level of human possibilities. The letter of the law is too cold and formal to have a beneficial influence on society. Whenever the tissue of life is woven of legalistic relations, there is an atmosphere of moral mediocrity, paralyzing man's noblest impulses. And it will be simply impossible to stand through the trials of this threatening century with only the support of a legalistic structure.

    In today's Western society the inequality has been revealed [in] freedom for good deeds and freedom for evil deeds. A statesman who wants to achieve something important and highly constructive for his country has to move cautiously and even timidly. There are thousands of hasty and irresponsible critics around him; parliament and the press keep rebuffing him. As he moves ahead, he has to prove that each single step of his is well-founded and absolutely flawless. Actually, an outstanding and particularly gifted person who has unusual and unexpected initiatives in mind hardly gets a chance to assert himself. From the very beginning, dozens of traps will be set out for him. Thus, mediocrity triumphs with the excuse of restrictions imposed by democracy.

    It is feasible and easy everywhere to undermine administrative power and in fact it has been drastically weakened in all Western countries. The defense of individual rights has reached such extremes as to make society as a whole defenseless against certain individuals. It's time, in the West -- It is time, in the West, to defend not so much human rights as human obligations.

    If humanism were right in declaring that man is born only to be happy, he would not be born to die. Since his body is doomed to die, his task on earth evidently must be of a more spiritual nature. It cannot be unrestrained enjoyment of everyday life. It cannot be the search for the best ways to obtain material goods and then cheerfully get the most of them. It has to be the fulfillment of a permanent, earnest duty so that one's life journey may become an experience of moral growth, so that one may leave life a better human being than one started it. It is imperative to review the table of widespread human values. Its present incorrectness is astounding. It is not possible that assessment of the President's performance be reduced to the question how much money one makes or of unlimited availability of gasoline. Only voluntary, inspired self-restraint can raise man above the world stream of materialism.
     
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  18. 06PTElectricBlue

    06PTElectricBlue Active Member

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    So couldn't someone with bone spurs still have served in some capacity? ;)

    [​IMG]
    WASHINGTON – Two daughters of a New York podiatrist say that 50 years ago their father diagnosed President Donald Trump with bone spurs in his heels as a favor to the doctor's landlord, Fred Trump, The New York Times reported Wednesday.

    Trump received five deferments from the draft for military service during the Vietnam War. He received four education deferments while he was a college student and a fifth deferment in 1968 for a medical exemption after he graduated.

    Larry Braunstein, who died in 2007, rented a ground floor office in a building owned by Trump in Jamaica, Queens. His daughters, Elysa Braunstein, 56, and Sharon Kessel, 53, told the Times that their father's role in Trump's diagnosis had become "family lore."

    "It was something we would always discuss," Elysa Braunstein told the Times. She and her sister are both Democrats who oppose Trump, according to the newspaper.

    Elysa Braunstein said their father made the diagnosis to gain access to the landlord and that she didn't know if her father even examined the junior Trump.

    "I know it was a favor," Elysa Braunstein said.

    "What he got was access to Fred Trump," she told the Times. "If there was anything wrong in the building, my dad would call and Trump would take care of it immediately. That was the small favor that he got."

    The women did not offer any documentation to back up their claims. They said their father's story also involved a second podiatrist, Manny Weinstein, who died in 1995. Weinstein's landlord was also Fred Trump.

    The White House did not make Trump available for a follow-up interview to the New York Times and did not respond to written questions about his service record.

    In October, the Times reported on how much Fred Trump helped his son through the years, giving him what today would be more than $410 million.

    Trump told the Times in 2016 that a doctor wrote him a letter for the draft board about the bone spurs – which Trump said were "temporary" and "minor" – but he could not recall the doctor's name.

    "I had a doctor that gave me a letter – a very strong letter on the heels," Trump told the Times.

    Questions about Trump's deferments have dogged him at least since 2011 when The Smoking Gun published an extract of his draft record. Critics have noted that Trump was an athlete who enjoyed playing football, baseball, squash, tennis and golf in the years before his medical deferment.

    "I was the best baseball player in New York when I was young," Trump told interviewer Michael D'Antonio in 2014. "I was always the best at sports."

    "It was a long time ago," Trump told reporters at a July 2015 campaign rally in Iowa. "I had student deferments and then ultimately had a medical deferment because of my feet. I had a bone spur."

    When asked which foot had the problem, Trump – who has claimed to have "one of the greatest memories of all time" – told reporters that he could not remember. His campaign later released a statement saying the spurs affected both feet.

    The late Sen. John McCain, a Vietnam veteran whom Trump said was not a war hero because he got captured, took a veiled shot at the president's medical deferment during an October 2017 C-SPAN interview.

    "One aspect of the conflict, by the way, that I will never ever countenance is that we drafted the lowest-income level of America, and the highest-income level found a doctor that would say that they had a bone spur. That is wrong. That is wrong. If we are going to ask every American to serve, every American should serve," McCain said.

    Trump's Vietnam bone spur diagnosis made as 'favor' to father: report (at https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2018/12/27/trump-vietnam-war-bone-spur-diagnosis/2420475002/ )
     
    #637 06PTElectricBlue, May 31, 2020
    Last edited: May 31, 2020
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  19. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    Well, COVID-19 is now so last week...

    The problem is that money and special interests have become entrenched in our political system. Trump was supposed to represent a break from special interests, albeit not from money. Unfortunately, he also brings a break from decency, rationality and plain reality.

    The goal of both political parties has shifted from getting elected to govern, to raising gobs money to get elected and stay in power. And as we speak it is shifting again to simply stay in power; screw the getting elected part.
     
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  20. Dave Z

    Dave Z It's me, Dave
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    [political stuff removed]

    You know how to get money out of elections?
    1) Supreme Court that knows the difference between advertising and protected speech
    2) Educational system that immunizes kids against advertising
    3) Educational system that immunizes kids against emotional appeals
    4) Educational system that immunizes kids against talking points and sound bites
    5) National media that does not tolerate talking points and stops using sound bites

    And for Heaven’s sake, why do these ads (which I see constantly on Facebook) have to use childish insults and Bad Caps?

    Untitled.jpg
     
    #639 Dave Z, May 31, 2020
    Last edited: May 31, 2020
  21. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    And let's not forget one of the most powerful special interests: the healthcare industry.

    The childish name-calling comes from the top.

    Name-calling is a key element of propaganda. During the war the Soviets used to call the Nazis the "Fascist Beasts." Every official pronouncement referred to Germans as the "Fascist Beast." The Nazis from their part used the term "untermensch" against anyone they wanted to justify atrocities.

    During the Cold War, Soviet-funded propaganda, whether it came from Russia, Cuba or elsewhere, used to call western democracies, and in particular Americans, the "Imperialists Pigs", and America's economic influence was commonly referred as "colonialism." For years the Iranian clerics finished every official pronouncement with "Death to America."
     
    #640 aldo90731, May 31, 2020
    Last edited: May 31, 2020
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