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Clutch Pedal Grab Point

Discussion in 'L: Horizon/Omni, Rampage, etc' started by 88horizon5speed, Jun 13, 2015.

  1. 88horizon5speed

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    what happened was I was driving along like normal and then all of a sudden the car would do a quick lundge forward and then back and the tach would go from about 2000 cruising speed and shoot to 0 and then shoot back to 2000. It happened very quick, maybe 1 second to drop and come back. Hopefully it was the clogged fuel filter and not something electrical. Never had electrical problems and all the electrical connections and wires in the car is in good looking shape
     
  2. Bob Lincoln

    Bob Lincoln "CHECK FAULT CODES"
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    Regular tuneups are the best defense against problems. Fuel filter is 5 years or 52,000 miles.
     
  3. ImperialCrown

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    Fuel problems generally won't cause an abrupt stall, maybe a sag or hesitation and it won't affect the tach.
    An electrical ignition problem in the primary circuit will cause the tach to jump and the engine to buck.
    It may be a poor connection at the computer or the distributor or a failing distributor pick-up plate. The ignition secondary circuit items like the rotor, cap, wires and plugs won't directly affect the tach, but must be in good shape.
     
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  4. floridaman2013

    floridaman2013 Active Member

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    I'm with IC on this one. Had plenty of Hall effect switches and a few coils start this way, even a few computers.
     
  5. dana44

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    Hall effects usually go down when warm and have to cool down 20 minutes or so before they restart. A die then run for a second every now and then sounds more like a loose wire of loose connection where a jolt breaks the connection randomly.

    Or heck, it could be metal flakes in the distributor floating around that grounds the hall effect, or the hall effect gap changing.
     
  6. 88horizon5speed

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    Would a failing hall affect pickup sensor be able to cause the rpms to appear to be 0? The whole symptom lasts about a second. It's impossible for the rpms to actually be 0. So does the HEP have anything to do with what the tach reads?

    Also in rock auto there's nothing called the hall effect pickup sensor but there is distributor pickup coil for $20. Is that it?
     
    #26 88horizon5speed, Jul 8, 2015
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2015
    Bob Lincoln likes this.
  7. dana44

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    The hall effect is the electronics points It is around the center shaft of the distributor under the cap and under the rotor. If it kept running, just cut out, it isn't the hall effect, they overheat and don't start when hot, then they cool and are good until they overheat again, but, check the insides and make sure there isn't any floating metal or crud in there that could essentially short for a second and then clear itself. Don't use anything metal on the hall effect itself, check the gap with a match book or non-metallic feeler/thickness as stated in the book for the gap. I don't know what it is, usually around .019-.021.
     
  8. 88horizon5speed

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    ok thanks for the advice ill check that out hen i have a chance. So other than that its probably an electrical connection? Which connections would have the greatest chance of being the culprit? I ask because theres alot of electrical connection in this almost 30 year old car!
     
  9. dana44

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    Heck, it is hard to say for sure, but starters would be from the distributor, to the coil, a connection or plug-in, even the ignition switch wire that makes things operate, turn the key shuts the car off. Other than connections, look for things like oily wires and scraped and frayed bundles.
     
  10. Bob Lincoln

    Bob Lincoln "CHECK FAULT CODES"
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    They CAN and sometimes do cut out quickly. When mine failed in my turbo, it skipped about a dozen times, stalled, restarted, kept skipping and cutting out. Very likely it is the HEP.
     
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  11. dana44

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    Over the years, the only thing I ever had happen to me, or to another Mopar was run fine, run about fifteen to twenty minutes, die, wait about ten minutes and run another 10 minutes, die about ten minutes, yeah, it can take a bit to get home that way.
     
  12. 88horizon5speed

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    This weekend I will take it apart tocsee if there's any contaminants and I'll likely be buying a new one rather way, its an $18 part.
     
  13. Bob Lincoln

    Bob Lincoln "CHECK FAULT CODES"
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    Check for side play by tugging sideways on the distributor shaft, try to wiggle it sideways. Should be no more than about .005 inches.
     
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  14. floridaman2013

    floridaman2013 Active Member

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    As Bob says on side play, when I worked the floor, I had replaced a few distributors for too much side play which drove the computor crazy. And, as Dana44 stated, check any ignition wiring that can be corroded, broken, frayed, loose, etc, but IMHO, would start with replacing the HE switch.
     
  15. GLHS60

    GLHS60 Well-Known Member

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    Momentarily falling tach/stumble is a classic symptom of distributor pickup and/or its connection.

    Thanks
    Randy
     
  16. 88horizon5speed

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    thanks for everyone's input i really appreciate it. I took the cap and rotor off and HE off. For reference the cap, rotor, plugs and wires are about 2 years/ 15000 miles old. There is carbon build up on the terminals inside the cap, mostly on the cylinder 1 terminal. There is a little bit of black carbon build up on the tip of the rotor but not alot (on the cap terminals is more like a small little blop of white build up. On the rotor tip its just a thin layer of black build up. There is a little bit of dust under the HE that appears to be corrosion dust from the outside of the distributor. No metal flakes though. There is some debree down there such as a small dead curled up spider and some misc debree but doesn't look like it was on the 4 pickups from the distributor that go to the under side of the HE. The HE appears to be in good shape. The wiring for the HE also looks to be in good shape.

    Correct me if i'm wrong, but the HE is what tells the computer what to display on the tach and what the timing and rpm is right?

    If so it must be the HE that is causing this problem where the tach goes to 0 and jumps back? Haven't had it happen in about 40 miles. Might as well just replace the HE then for $18?
     
  17. dana44

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    You are correct. Clean her out real good, that corrosion can float around and cause the spark to jump and move around from place to place. Might not think about it, but any amount of debris in there is capable of the electricity to jump around when and where it isn't supposed to, or, at the same time, ground out, even for a split second or two, the correct itself, the pieces moving around because of the rotor spinning and having a little vortex of sorts in there. Dead spider, huh? 15K is quite a few miles for a cap and rotor, plug wires every other time the sparkplugs are changed as long as the plug wires themselves are not physically removed from the plugs (unless they are solid copper wires).
     
  18. 88horizon5speed

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    OK so there is no wiggle room side to side. I cleaned it the best I can (don't have a compressor) and drove another 25 miles or so and it drives like a dream. I'm going to buy a new cap, rotor, and HEP sensor and install them. Thanks for the help everyone if anything else happends I'll post in in here but in a new post lol
     
  19. GLHS60

    GLHS60 Well-Known Member

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    Replacement jobber HEP's can be very unreliable so don't toss out the old one, maybe keep it as a spare.
    I find its one of the items that have given our cars a bad reputation over the years as the HEP and its wiring/connectors can cause intermittent problems that a new part doesn't always fix. I can't remember how many 2.2/2.5 cars I've seen with new everything and still a problem. Falling tach has been the clue for me although not everyone notices, and many cars don't have tachs. I have kept known good used HEPs on hand for years mainly as I drive these cars and like them, but many people, shops, mechanics etc. don't have the time or interest. I have the sickness of trying to find the exact problem, which is often not solved with regular maintenance items.

    Thanks
    Randy
     
  20. 88horizon5speed

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    Yea I agree with everything you just said and thanks for the heads up I will keep the original as a spare. And I agree I love my car its been a very good car to me so far. I just wish i could have owned it since new. The build quality if my car is s much better than people seem to think. Maybe thats why mine is one of the last on the road still fully functioning ha..
     

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