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Engine/transmission Bell Housings

Discussion in 'Repairs, Maintenance, Help' started by TWX, Aug 19, 2009.

  1. Trailmaster

    Trailmaster Move Over Plymouth Aproaching Rapidly

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    All 331 Hemis used the same SAE round pattern, the industrial reference was to give a comparision.

    I believe the Cummins is an SAE round pattern also, but I'm not sure which one.

    Link to SAE bellhousing pattern chart. http://www.garbee.net/~cabell/sae.htm

    Torque Command was the correct AMC name for the Torqueflite, so no need for the question mark.

    And for the transmissions list, Jeeps used the TH400 GM trans in the trucks/wagoneers in the 60s/70s, and in CJs with QuadraTrac from 76-79. Early AMC version TH400s used Buick pattern for use behind the Dauntless engines, later versions used the GenIII V8 pattern. If AMC had their own name for the TH400 I'm unaware of it. AMC stuff get confusing sometimes.

    According to wikipedia 68RFE is used behind the 6.7L cummins, is similar to 45 and 454rfe but has a larger bell housing.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chrysler_RFE_transmission
     
  2. digitalrailroader

    digitalrailroader Active Member

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    where would you find the Number cast on the Trans Casing? would it be on the Diff Housing? or on the Transfer Gear cover?
     
  3. valiant67

    valiant67 Rich Corinthian Leather
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    The Dakota used the Chrysler 2.2 for 1987 and 1988.
    Then the Chrysler 2.5 from 1989-1995.
    Then the AMC/Jeep 2.5 from 1996 to whenever.
    If they offered an automatic, it was with the Jeep 2.5. I'm not sure there was one though.
     
  4. TWX

    TWX DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS!
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    Was the "Torque Command" version of the 904 series only available in the 904 itself, or was it produced for 998 and 999 models too? Was the 727 called a torque command, and if so, which bellhousings was it available in for AMC/Jeep?

    As for the number on the case, I found some documentation from ATSG from 1990 and an update from 1994 that gave me the numbers. If you do a search for "ATSG 604" you'll probably find the docs in PDF. Surprisingly the 1994 docs didn't yet have any reference to the Neon/Powertech four cylinders.
     
  5. TWX

    TWX DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS!
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    I'm looking, and it looks like the back of the Cummins 6B series uses a bolt-on adapter to provide a bellhousing pattern. I found a picture of this adapter with an SAE round pattern. The engine, it looks like, has a trapezoidal pattern that accomodates the bellhousing adapter.

    This makes me wonder if Mopar uses a different bellhousing adapter that isn't necessarily a round SAE pattern in order to hook up to an A618 or 68RFE transmission. That also makes me wonder if they ever changed things throughout the years.
     
  6. Bob Lincoln

    Bob Lincoln "CHECK FAULT CODES"
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    The Buick V-6 was a 231 CID, wasn't it? Or did you mean the aluminum V6 from the 1960s, which was a 215 CID?
     
  7. Trailmaster

    Trailmaster Move Over Plymouth Aproaching Rapidly

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    Not sure on the 998/999 models, but both the 727 and 904 were called Torque Command, and the bellhousing pattern would have been the AMC GenIII bellhousing. They used a completely different case, but all the internals are supposed to be the same.
     
  8. Trailmaster

    Trailmaster Move Over Plymouth Aproaching Rapidly

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    From jeepfan.com
     
  9. dana44

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    So would this be the Turbo350/400/700R4 bolt pattern or something specific , i.e., 3.4/4.3 or something like this (or stupidly is this the same pattern?
     
  10. TWX

    TWX DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS!
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    On the 2.5 engines, from what I read (can't find a source immediately) they bought 2.5L engines from GM, in the form of the Iron Duke. When they decided to build an in-house 2.5, they designed one that still uses a GM pattern, mainly because they were using that pattern on other engines of theirs at the time. The history that I read indicated that the 4.2/4.0 series V6 was the basis for the 2.5 I4, where they essentially removed the two middle cylinders. They did change the head though, and those changes might have made their way into the 4.0L I6 that was used into almost recent times.

    I should have save a sources list. *sigh*
     
  11. Bearhawke

    Bearhawke Things happen for a reason

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    So do the 1972+ 232/258/4.0L Sixes and probably 2.5L four bangers as well. :)
     
  12. dana44

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    A-604/41TE is the tranny used behind the Jeep Wrangler 3.8 (2006 and up). There is a little more info on the 3.8 engine page.
     
  13. digitalrailroader

    digitalrailroader Active Member

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    Uh, You guys Never answered my question. WHERE is this Number Cast on the bellhousing? is it On Top of the Bellhousing, on Bottom, on the Side near the Firewall, On the side near the Radiator, INSIDE the bellhousing? WHERE!?! because i have a 41TE with a 2.0L attached to it! all i need is the location of this number and i can tell you!
     
  14. Marcos

    Marcos Well-Known Member

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    I keep hearing references to a 4sp. (fwd) auto that was made for the 2.5L 4cyl engines, possibly for the mexican market only, but I have yet to see any concrete evidence that this existed. Anyone have anything to back this up? Productions figures, or photos of such a unit? I've seen the bellhousing diagram in the ATSG manual, but they could have just lifted the same diagram of the 3sp. I'm not trying to contradict or start a debate, just extremely curious.
     
  15. TWX

    TWX DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS!
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    When I get home I'll try to remember to look up where that number is cast into the transmission at.

    A friend of mine had a Dodge 600 with a four speed auto A604, and the minivans had the A604 with the 2.5L as well, so that transmission was paired with the big inline four in at least some applications.
     
  16. valiant67

    valiant67 Rich Corinthian Leather
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    Neither the Dodge 600 nor the minivans offered a 2.5 with an A604. The 2.5 always got the three speed auto or a manual transmission, nothing else in the US. As mentioned before, unconfirmed rumors exist that the 2.5 got the A604 in other markets. But the Dodge 600 ended production in 1988, the year before the A604 was even introduced.
     
  17. TWX

    TWX DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS!
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    I could have sworn that my friend's '86 600 with a 2.5L had four forward gears...

    He sold it already anyway, oh well.
     
  18. TWX

    TWX DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS!
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    The picture makes it look like the number is cast on the rib between the bell and the CV shaft hole. They do specifically say that it's on the bell in the literature, though.
     
  19. dana44

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    I would think the fourth gear may actually have been the lockup of the torque converter itself, making the feel of a fourth gear, which is what I thought the first time I drove a Neon back in early years.
     
  20. TWX

    TWX DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS!
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    Maybe. The closest we ever came to working on the transmission was to fix the shift lever coming out of the case when the dang thing somehow got bent and wouldn't work right.
     

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