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FCA + Peugeot in Talks

Discussion in 'Mopar News' started by Dan Minick, Oct 29, 2019.

  1. Adventurer55

    Adventurer55 Well-Known Member

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    I meant bean counter. Sorry.
     
  2. valiant67

    valiant67 ...

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    I'll just start with one simple line:
    "That Jeep has been truly invigorated for the first time in its long originallyGLOBAL history.....credit ALL to Elkaan/Marchionne."

    That line is blatantly incorrect. Nothing Elkann or Marchionne did for Jeep would have amounted to a hill of beans without the previous efforts by Chrysler, DCX, American Motors, etc. Yes, they kept following the path already established and that was generally good - but they aren't worthy of the ALL credit.
    Indeed the single biggest product that altered Jeep's trajectory (and preceded both FCA and Chrysler) is likely the 1984 Jeep Cherokee which was the first step out of the mainly utilitarian functional Jeeps and into modern, at least semi-luxurious Jeeps. The old Grand Wagoneer of the time just didn't sell in high enough numbers to significantly alter Jeep's image.

    This Cherokee, like the original Chrysler minivan, opened up a new market niche and exploded in popularity.This was really the beginning of the SUV craze that's still going on.
     
  3. duster92

    duster92 Well-Known Member

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  4. Donte Lindsey

    Donte Lindsey Active Member

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    plymouth1, page2171 and aldo90731 like this.
  5. Dave Z

    Dave Z It's me, Dave
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    Absolutely. Beijing Jeep was done in the 1980s. Jeep really started exploding under AMC/Renault ownership and Chrysler kept it going partly by adding factory capacity, so the ZJ didn't have to replace the XJ, but could slot in above it. The Renegade was a major move forward in Europe and South America, to be fair, and that might be what he meant.
     
  6. pumadog

    pumadog Well-Known Member

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    Where did he say so? From the ANE article:
    He does not rule out job cuts and AFAIK he doesn't rule out plant closings. It's just that they save big money already even without closures. So that might happen after some years IMHO. For sure not immediately, they need to get the green light from governments after all.
     
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  7. Corcorcor

    Corcorcor Member

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  8. Adventurer55

    Adventurer55 Well-Known Member

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    I have tried to find the source of his interview, but I haven't ran back across it. This may have been when the merger was first announced about no factory closings and no loss of jobs. I don't see how he can keep 13 brands fed either. That's more then VAG has. Something will have to give eventually, unless the brands are kept solely to regions only.
     
  9. 77 Monaco Brougham

    77 Monaco Brougham Active Member

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    Not Necessarily. The RAM badge can continue while at the same time eliminating it t as a brand. Simply badge the pickups as:

    RAM By Dodge There...Problem solved!
     
    #329 77 Monaco Brougham, Nov 8, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2019
    GasAxe likes this.
  10. pumadog

    pumadog Well-Known Member

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    In contrast to the current FCA management he has no problem to let several sister cars compete with each other, built on the same platforms. The different brand characters add to bigger sales and margins. Does it matter if he feeds 3 or 5 European breadandbutter brands?

    Possible future platform/production synergies:
    European Bread and butter: Peugeot, Citroen, Opel/Vauxhall, Fiat – Small Electro/CMP/EMP2/Small Wide
    Niche Premium: DS, Lancia (are they regarded as living standalone brands at all?) – Small Electro/CMP/EMP2/Small Wide (+ BOF for vans)
    Sporty Premium: Alfa Romeo – CMP/Small Wide/Giorgio
    Luxury: Maserati – Giorgio/Bespoke
    American Bread and Butter: Chrysler – CMP/EMP2/Small Wide/Compact Wide
    American Sports: Dodge – Giorgio
    Offroad Specialist: Jeep – Small Wide/Compact Wide/Giorgio/BOF
    Pickup Specialist: RAM – BOF

    I guess CMP/EMP2/Small Wide/Compact Wide will be developed to only 2 surviving platforms in the long term. Makes it 3 general platforms incl. Giorgio for RWD.
     
  11. aldo90731

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    People keep calling it the Dodge Ram, anyway.
     
  12. valiant67

    valiant67 ...

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    Much like the old: Imperial by Chrysler logos.
     
    #332 valiant67, Nov 8, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2019
    77 Monaco Brougham likes this.
  13. valiant67

    valiant67 ...

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    I agree, they continued development and the Renegade is a perfect example.
    But much of Jeep's current success, especially in North America, rests on the older, larger, designs that predate FCA.
     
    Bill Sample and gforce2002 like this.
  14. T_690

    T_690 Well-Known Member

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    John Elkann: “La fusione con Psa è appena cominciata, faremo cose grandi” - La Stampa (at https://www.lastampa.it/cronaca/2019/11/08/news/john-elkann-la-fusione-con-psa-e-appena-cominciata-faremo-cose-grandi-1.37876180?refresh_ce )

    Twenty years ago, when I started working on it, Fiat was in a very difficult situation. It wasn't competitive against its standards. We re-designed it in the future, with the merger with Chrysler. And now with Psa we are excited to imagine the challenges of the future and the opportunities that open up". John Elkann chooses the Technology Festival and the Polytechnic of Turin, where he graduated in 2000, to comment for the first time publicly on the merger project between Fca and Psa: "For now the merger has been announced, making it will take some time, even a long time". But the challenges that the new group will have to face in the world of tomorrow, for the president of Fca, are at least three:

    "The automotive industry is about to experience an epoch-making change, similar in scope to that of the 1920s. There is a transition from a combustion engine to an electric motor or other propulsion system. There will be a major technical change that will change the internal dimensions of vehicles because the electric motor needs different spaces. Today the car is the product that contains more software than all the others, but the next few years will see an evolution of the interface and a greater connection.

    The third big development element will be the autonomous driving: "I can proudly say that we are the only group in the world to have developed a car that works completely independently, in Arizona, in partnership with Google. The way we move and see transport functions will change, but there are still a lot of problems to be solved.

    The logic of mergers remains for Elkann the way to go to equip himself better because of this momentous change. "We have benefited a lot from the agreement with Chrysler and Peugeot of the one with Opel. Only industrial operations made to spread the investments on more cars. Now the next twenty years will bring many opportunities: finding solutions with less environmental impact, new ways to make cities work. In this context, a city like Turin, with its education system and Polytechnic, is very well placed to contribute to this challenge. In the logic of the aggregation in progress Elkann sees a new role for Turin: "The city had a great development when the capital of Italy was transferred to Florence. There was a great identity crisis from which we came out investing in new solutions. Today we are at a similar time. Turin is the heart of the investment in electric propulsion and for this reason, assures Elkann, "the strength of the city, linked to its past in the automotive industry will be its strength also in the future".
     
    #334 T_690, Nov 8, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2019
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  15. 77 Monaco Brougham

    77 Monaco Brougham Active Member

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    Exactly! To this day, I STILL hear people ignoring the name RAM and calling them Dodge.

    Hey, might as well give the people what they want.
     
  16. Chebby7

    Chebby7 Active Member

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    RAM will always be Dodge in our hearts :)
     
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  17. Tony K

    Tony K Active Member

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    At what cost? I'm agnostic about it either way, but how much money and energy will it actually take, and what are the long-term implications, not to mention what message does it send? The last thing I'd think a company would want to do is change branding on something that's successful. Sure, you could make that argument about the change TO Ram, but two wrongs don't make a right, that being the case.
     
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  18. BASONE88

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    Once this merger is cooked, FCA's corporate average of 120.5 g/liter will drop significantly (I think this is, perhaps, one of the biggest motives). FCA will no longer be dinged by the European Union and fund Tesla with "hundreds of millions" of $$$. In that regard, FCA and Tesla are already in a partnership..Tesla's success is, in part, thanks to FCA.

    With no debt and the savings FCA will realize (with PSA), FCA is a cashcow. Wouldn't you want to be a part of that? I would say yes to that faster than Leah Prichett can get down the quarter mile!
     
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  19. BASONE88

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    I have to shake my head (and chuckle) a little. For all the $$ and effort put forth to make RAM separate, most still refer to them as a Dodge.
     
    HotCarNut and wtxiceman like this.
  20. rmtodd

    rmtodd Well-Known Member

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    On the bright side, if you branded the Rams as Dodges again, there wouldn't be so much blowback when the Durango, Charger and Challenger followed the Caravan and Journey into the history books.
     

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