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FCA quality: lousy scores

Discussion in 'Mopar / FCA News' started by valiant67, Feb 22, 2017.

  1. valiant67

    valiant67 ...

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    You can get a little more data than the common chart - but not much - for free. The results, by make, in general categories:
    pcr study (at http://www.jdpower.com/ratings/study/Vehicle-Dependability-Study-%28VDS%29-by-Make/1881ENG )
     
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  2. Moparian

    Moparian Well-Known Member

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    How they handle my lemon case will greatly determine whether I stick with Mopar or move on to another brand. My current plan, assuming they buy back my car, is to pick up a left over 16 Renegade with a stick and pay it off within a year or 2 and then pick up a Challenger Scat Pack or if my career has advanced enough a widebody Hellcat. If I have to jump through hoops and they drag this process out I'm going elsewhere. Regarding Ford or GM, I'd go Ford personally. There isnt much that does anything for me over on the GM side, the Camaro is too small and the Corvette way too expensive and impractical for me.
     
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  3. hmk123

    Level III Supporter

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    Thanks! What always puzzles me with these that there are differences between Jeep, Chrysler, RAM and Dodge for example. Sure, I get it there are different plants. But interior components all come from the same OEMs for FCA, right? Or power trains. Doesn't Jeep use the same as Dodge and Chrysler? I always found it suspicious when CR for example rated a 300 more reliable over a Charger or vice versa.
     
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  4. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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  5. npaladin2000

    npaladin2000 LOAD "*",8,1

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    It's also interesting that Chrysler is so much better than Jeep. Supposedly anyway.
     
  6. valiant67

    valiant67 ...

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    Yes - those things happen. And studying why similar parts give different results in different brands would help understand the perception part of the quality equation.
     
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  7. MPE426HEMI

    MPE426HEMI Well-Known Member

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    According to that, Jeep is about as bad as Fiat. To be honest, I can't say the Dodge or Jeep "marks" are anything typical I can relate to. Nothing there really would make me change my mind about buying either brand. I know on tv commercials, JD power awards are sometimes mentioned, but I never pay any mind to it.
     
    #767 MPE426HEMI, May 8, 2017
    Last edited: May 8, 2017
  8. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    As I have said before, a higher % of loyal owners relative to total sales will provide more favorable results.

    Jeep has been growing, which means it has been conquesting new customers, who tend to be more critical. Chrysler has been shrinking, with loyal customers usually last to leave and tend to be more lenient.

    Besides that, there's too little product overlap between Chrysler and Jeep to expect similar results.
     
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  9. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    Based on my brother's experience with his Renegade: his Jeep is a FIAT.
     
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  10. MPE426HEMI

    MPE426HEMI Well-Known Member

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    Well, there you go! Seems to fit JD's ratings then.
     
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  11. MPE426HEMI

    MPE426HEMI Well-Known Member

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    I've never really put much stock, as one would say, into any of these types of ratings. And I've had decent success. But that's not to say other consumers don't. That's why I think it's important that FCA take these matters seriously and get down to fixing it and sooner than later. If not for me, a long time loyal buyer, then for all the potential new customers. Did SM even mention anything about these ratings lately? Or what the plan was? Or if he through it was all hogwash? I'd like his take on it. He seems to have a lot to say about other things. I'm about 2-3 years out on another purchase, but I'll be watching this closely.
     
  12. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    All he talks about these days is debt, stock prices and mergers.
     
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  13. Prabhjot

    Prabhjot Active Member

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    Perhaps they ought to've bought the Renegade's close-sibling, then: the 500X which is, or so this lot claim:

    We like the Fiat 500X despite the faults | Long-term Update (at http://www.autoblog.com/2017/05/05/fiat-500x-long-term-update-flawed-but-charming/ )

    They say nothing about unreliable, poor quality (judged how? adjusted for price, surely? etc), poor dealer+service. You are certain, then, that your family's renegade is much more 'representative' than autoblog's 500X? Even though the Renegade sells at 8-10x the 500X does in the usa? etc

    Now, this one guy, if he is included in a j d power survey would be provide the 'serial' data points which J D Power would then weight, rank, etc? Does J D Power apply 'discount rates' for certain data points? They should since price points vary, vehicle genres vary, brand-promises vary, car purpose-built engineering-mix vary, ambient weather+driving conditions vary, driving style and care vary according to a whole host of sociocultural and economic and geographical factors, etc etc. If so, on what basis? Price, for one, surely? Statistical patterns from.....the past? Data from more crowd-sourced data like say WarrantyDirect (uk) which are SO often at GREAT variance from what J D Power comes up with in terms of as-you-admit often statistically-irrelevant RANKINGs.

    etc

    IMO any sort of major reliance on this 'desperate search for risk-free AND uncertain decision making'-capitalising pseudo scientific, pseudo analytic survey-based and 'statistical' data-analysis EVEN by automakers etc let alone by consumers, not to mention customers is daft. Helpful on the margin, if the sample size is large enough, etc, and to FLAG otherwise slow-to-be discerned patterns, otherwise adds exactly nothing imo, beyond generic 'work hard and invest IF you have the money on EVERYTHING at once, etc etc'. Generic so-called management 'wisdom'. Of course it is all about (a) mplementation difficulties, esp behavioural, 'cultural' etc and costs-given-scarce resources (b) 'marketing', branding, identity/authenticity etc building, which after all deals in the un- and even the ir-rational (eg Dodge Demon!) NOT risk-free-data-analytics.

    @aldo90731
     
  14. valiant67

    valiant67 ...

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    So one review that likes the 500x "despite the faults" offsets the problems Aldo's family had with the Renegade. So we are at what, a 50/50 chance at getting a "good" one based on two anecdotal stories? Why are people more willing to accept single points than aggregate data?

    At this rate, we'll even having the same conversation in 10 years if FCA is still in the US market.
     
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  15. valiant67

    valiant67 ...

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    It's a short term position in an industry that requires long term focus.
     
  16. redriderbob

    redriderbob Mopar Guru!
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    Simple... less debts mean stock is worth more... great when you are about to retire!
     
  17. Erik Latranyi

    Erik Latranyi Allpar Legacy

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    When multiple bad quality reports came out a few years ago, Marchionne fired Doug Betts, who was head of quality.

    It appears that he was just cost-cutting (firing a long-term, high salary employee) because nothing has improved since.
     
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  18. MPE426HEMI

    MPE426HEMI Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I remember thinking, at that time, what SM was going to do next, after Betts. I guess the answer was nothing.
    This time, maybe he should fire himself?
     
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  19. Christopher

    Christopher Socially Unacceptable
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    I was thinking as I was reading this thread that a great deal will depend on your own personal experience.


    I believe that most people are more concerned about how a problem is addressed than the fact that they had a problem in the first place.
     
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  20. MPE426HEMI

    MPE426HEMI Well-Known Member

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    You're correct. Look at the Toyota and Honda lovers. Those cars are no better than anything FCA has now. But if trouble arises, which it occasionally do, with all brands, they seem to have a better way of handling it. And what that equals is a repeat buyer. And a better customer service rating. 5 stars instead of 1
     
    #780 MPE426HEMI, May 8, 2017
    Last edited: May 8, 2017
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