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Fiat Chrysler in talks to forge extensive ties with Renault

Discussion in 'Mopar News' started by HEMI345, May 25, 2019.

  1. 77 Monaco Brougham

    77 Monaco Brougham Active Member

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    As they say in North American elections..."Every Vote Counts!"

    Who knows if those Nissan votes might be needed someday on some future issue?

     
  2. T_690

    T_690 Well-Known Member

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  3. T_690

    T_690 Well-Known Member

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    I don't see a future for a Chrysler as a premium brand but I don't see Infiniti's future at all.
     
  4. codypet

    codypet Well-Known Member

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    I guess it depends on how the dealer network is, but I assume Chrysler has a larger dealer network than Infiniti. You either shut down the Infiniti locations or make them CDJ locations. Hypothetically if you move Chrysler into Infiniti's spot and you shed Dodge of the Journey and Caravan, now you have a CDJR retail dealership of vehicles that command a premium over the lower margin ones (Nissan and Ram fleets).
     
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  5. Ryan

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    Or utilize Infiniti dealerships to service and sell an expanded variety of Alfa Romeo models, eliminating one of the glaring problems with Alfa. I'd imagine the Infiniti dealership experience is also better than that of current Alfa dealers which would improve the brand perception.

    I like that idea a lot better. Alfa could become a (more) viable brand.
     
  6. AlexB

    AlexB Active Member

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    Well from all things seen $FCAU is the surviving stock.
     
  7. T_690

    T_690 Well-Known Member

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    Hmh, can yo explain it.

    I don't see any proof of Exor buying Renault shares. And they are saying it's a 50.50 merger.

    Of course we do know that Agnelli's will be at the top, but...
     
  8. AlexB

    AlexB Active Member

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    As mentioned earlier on in this thread, The Company is Netherlands which means FCA is doing the buying, through stock dilution (issuing new shares of FCA) and the one creating the "paperwork"/proposal.
     
  9. Ernesto

    Ernesto Active Member

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    Those of us who used to hang out at Nissan Distribution in Elizabeth, NJ affectionately called it Assan Distribution. Well, maybe not so affectionately.
     
  10. Dan Minick

    Level III Supporter

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    ScramFan likes this.
  11. AlexB

    AlexB Active Member

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    Guys, what is funny is this Bank Of America analyst who claim there are no synergies in Europe because of no plant closures:rolleyes:.
    It's like he don't understand there's other savings than plant closures.
     
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  12. Mopar International

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    No, the company is controlled by Renault. Renault (80.1%) Samsung (19.9%)
     
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  13. randy1911

    randy1911 Active Member

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    Infiniti was just removed from foreign markets due to low demand, infiniti and alfa goes after similar consumers in America, I would imagine it's the same globally. Dissolve infiniti globally. America takes its place in America only Alfa gets its place globally Alfa leaves the American market because its losing a battle and sales are nothing to be proud of. In America and Middle East you have dodge jeep ram Chrysler Nissan. In other parts of the world you have Renault Nissan Jeep Ram.
     
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  14. Ryan

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    Alfa sales aren't anything to be proud of in part because the dealer network is small. If they could utilize Infiniti's network, or allow CDJR dealerships to become Jeep-Ram-Alfa dealerships if Dodge and Chrysler are phased out (which I would support at this point), Alfas could become much more common. The downside to Jeep-Ram-Alfa dealerships would be that existing CDJR dealers are known for their poor customer satisfaction, so adding a luxury brand to the mix would bring down satisfaction for Alfa.

    I think the best course of action would be to dissolve Infiniti, like you said, and let Alfa take its place here. Then if Chrysler and Dodge are discontinued, allow Jeep-Ram dealerships to add Nissan or Mitsubishi to their portfolio as more mainstream options. Nissan can also stop development of the Titan in this case because Ram will become the pickup option at these dealerships.

    I also think Alfa vehicles should be serviceable at any CDJR (or similar) dealership just as Cadillac, Buick, and GMC vehicles can be serviced by a Chevy-only dealership.
     
  15. Donte Lindsey

    Donte Lindsey Active Member

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    I like this but I doubt anything happens to Infiniti. If anything they rebadge a few as Chyslers.
     
  16. randy1911

    randy1911 Active Member

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    Alfa has no value in America hopefully the new company realizes this. Why buy alfa if u can have mb, bmw or audi. Alfa in America is the same as infiniti over seas and the Japanese was smart enough to figure out that is not worth it. Alfa in America will always be niche. Secondly you don't want alfa in America replacing infiniti alfa don't have the best reputation nor the number of dealers nor the customer base that believes value in its name. Alfa in America is one step better than fiat in America both pointless. Thirdly Alfa, and infiniti, competes globally by dissolving infiniti alfa takes it place globally but in America and the middle east Chrysler takes its place. You save money, dealerships, and gross economies.
    It just makes sense
    Your dealership structure in America goes Nissan, Dodge Chrysler and Jeep Ram as the other network.
    You have those with the square footage available to be a global supercenter with Chrysler Dodge Jeep Ram Nissan in America.
    Drop fiat and alfa in America give those dealerships jeep ram centers they will be happy.
     
  17. Ryan

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    Your bias is showing. They do need some more models which they are getting soon. The Tonale is in a hugely popular segment and will stand out with distinct styling and driving characteristics. Infiniti vehicles are based on dated platforms and have decent but slightly boring designs. They don't do anything better than any other luxury brand, thus they can easily become irrelevant if challenged by a brand like Alfa that produces cars that look and drives differently than anything else.

    The customer base of Alfa would increase if they were more widely available, both for sales and service, and if the dealership reputations improve.

    And also this -
    - applies more to the idea of a premium Chrysler (and Infiniti as it currently is) than it does Alfa. Why buy a Chrysler (or Infiniti) when you can buy a BMW or Audi? Alfa is a different animal because they focus on Italian styling and driving dynamics. What would Chrysler offer to set it apart? They can have a MB level interior and Audi-level quality, but the car market is saturated and they need to do something different than the other luxury to stand out. Genesis is also experiencing this currently - they have perfectly good cars, but why would someone buy a Genesis over a known player when there are few-if-any advantages to owning a Genesis? Infiniti is hardly a stand-out luxury brand either. Alfa does stand out by marketing and engineering cars that are more connected to the road and don't look like every other bland German vehicle.

    I also think the Pacifica could be moved to Nissan and Chrysler and Dodge could be phased out in this plan. There are a huge number of brands and Chrysler and Dodge seem to be the weakest links. While it could be argued that Alfa is a weaker brand, it's also got the ability to react more quickly to market changes because it has higher margins that could potentially absorb the some of the cost of battery and autonomous tech. Chrysler as a mainstream brand is also unnecessary if Nissan and Mitsubishi are in the portfolio. The only things propping Dodge up are the Charger and Challenger and who knows how long it'll be before their appeal is gone. Of course, Nissan may also be off the table which would make a lot of that impossible.

    I like the idea of a brand that can put vehicles in as many segments as possible, but I love the idea of a brand that is leaner and more responsive to market changes, because the latter brand has a better chance of long-term survival--that's why the idea of this merger is starting to excite me.
     
    #217 Ryan, May 28, 2019
    Last edited: May 28, 2019
  18. vipergts2207

    vipergts2207 Active Member

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    So who takes the place of Dodge and Chrysler in this plan exactly? Nissan and Mitsubishi? That doesn’t seem very well thought out considering that the number of people cross-shopping those marques is probably pretty small. The biggest overlap would probably be the 300 with the Maxima and Altima. Maybe the Durango with one of Nissan’s SUVs. Seems to me all this plan would do is drive the Challenger customers to Ford and Chevy and many Charger buyers to a Kia Stinger. And in the latter’s case, at a critical point when Dodge (and Chrysler to a lesser extent) has a chance to pick up some former Chevy and Ford car buyers who no longer have a sedan to buy from one of those two marques. Isn’t Nissan’s reputation largely one of car rental grade vehicles?
     
  19. Ryan

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    Maxima could finally become a true RWD sport sedan to replace the Charger. I don’t know what to do about the Challenger, but one vehicle is hardly a reason to keep a brand in existence.
     
  20. codypet

    codypet Well-Known Member

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    Here's how it can go then after all this discussion.
    CDJR dealerships
    Jeep is Jeep
    Dodge finally gets its muscle sporty cars it'd planned to have (LX, sport Avenger hatch, Sport SUVs)
    Chrysler moves into a American Luxury spot (current Pacifica, 300, Chrysler SUV etc)
    Rams still get sold at CDJR dealerships

    Infiniti dealerships
    go to Alfa/Maseratti and Infiniti is killed off

    Nissan dealerships
    Nissan becomes the people mover (old Plymouth. Portal/Voyager/Caravan replacement and Nissan's normal lineup)
    Ram is sold in both Nissan dealerships combined with their NV vans for fleet sales.

    Mitsu dealerships
    Fiat is killed off in NA for Mitsubishi.

    European Renault cars and SUV's are sprinkled along all the car lines where they make sense to fit.

    This is my wild speculation on what can happen.
     
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