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GM accuses Fiat Chrysler of corrupt bargaining with UAW

Discussion in 'Mopar News' started by Polish Don, Nov 20, 2019.

  1. gforce2002

    gforce2002 Well-Known Member

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    The sales figure rigging seems to have been true. Who knows about the rest, though I wouldn’t put it past them. I guess we’ll find out as this goes along.
     
  2. XRT2SRT

    XRT2SRT Well-Known Member

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    Something tells me that GM's finger pointing is nothing more than an indication of their internal frustrations: FCA having success in areas it thought it would be superior since FCA seemed to be going stale.
     
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  3. AmbassadorSST

    AmbassadorSST Active Member

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    She never was...Mary was made CEO to give GM a softer edge and to make them appear to look "modern".
    Mary was part of the corrupt "old GM" cabal, who is now head of the "new GM" cabal.
     
  4. 1969 300

    1969 300 Well-Known Member

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    Nobody in corporate American should have a “holier than thou” attitude because dirt at the executive level is more prevalent than not. I have also found that “celebrity CEOs” and those that are constantly hogging the spotlight are the dirtiest.

    In regards to this lawsuit, I could just imagine, if this goes to trial, FCA/PSA’s lawyers having a field day with GM execs. Ponder these questions:

    • So you are saying that the alleged impropriety that FCA targeted toward GM caused you (GM) to loose market share in the large truck segment?
    • Was it FCA’s fault that you chose to cancel the proposed Wrangler fighter?
    • Is it FCA’s fault that you just had a 40- day strike with your hourly employees and it had nothing to do with the fact that GM is closing plants in light of record profits and shipping jobs to Mexico and China?
    • If Iacobelli was such a rogue character as you mentioned, why did you hire him? Don’t you do extensive background checks on those you hire on an executive level? Was any fallout from this poor hire your fault?
     
    #84 1969 300, Nov 25, 2019
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 25, 2019
  5. 1969 300

    1969 300 Well-Known Member

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    GM is the only top ten global automaker without a European presence. When Barra took over, GM was the third largest automaker in the world (very close to being second). After the FCA/PSA merger, GM will be a solid fifth. GM is pissed because without the Opel division they gave away, they still would have been fourth. In essence, GM indirectly helped FCA/PSA leapfrog them.
     
  6. 1969 300

    1969 300 Well-Known Member

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    It would have helped if PDL would have interviewed someone other than a convicted criminal for his story. Marchione may have been difficult to work for, but for Chrysler he was what was needed at the time. Chrysler came very close to oblivion in 2008. I am sure that it would have been gutted had GM taken over it as they were offered in 2008. BTW, I am sure that FCA execs could care less what PDL or any other columnist writes.
     
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  7. aldo90731

    Level III Supporter

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    Sergio was no angel and, in all likelihood, he was guilty as sin. But everyone rolled their eyes when GM announced it was selling Opel and leaving Europe.

    Tavares turned Opel into a profitable entity much sooner than anyone expected, making a fool of GM in the process. On that count, Barra only has herself to blame.
     
  8. 77 Monaco Brougham

    77 Monaco Brougham Active Member

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    When you peel away all the flowery legal language, what you've really got here is an extortion scheme directly pointed at both entities which will become "PF".

    At "F" because they see an opportunity to vent some corporate anger and jealousy over product / sales, and at "P" out of a vengeful fury / embarrassment over being shown up to the entire automotive community over Opel.
     
    #88 77 Monaco Brougham, Nov 25, 2019
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 25, 2019
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  9. Stéphane Dumas

    Stéphane Dumas Well-Known Member

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    #89 Stéphane Dumas, Nov 25, 2019
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 25, 2019
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  10. 77 Monaco Brougham

    77 Monaco Brougham Active Member

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    Good old Yogi! What a shame that Major League Baseball doesn't have colorful characters like that anymore.

    When the game's biggest star at the moment is Mike Trout...a man so boring that he makes a bowl of oatmeal seem exciting...

    No wonder MLB is dying a very slow...agonizing death.
     
  11. djsamuel

    Level 2 Supporter

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    After reading that I'm ready to purchase a bust of Peter DeLorenzo so I can worship him. Wasted several minutes reading his blatant self promotion.
     
  12. T_690

    T_690 Well-Known Member

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    According to analysts... China!
     
  13. T_690

    T_690 Well-Known Member

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    Exor is controlling Ferrari together with Piero Ferrari.

    New group could be run in similar fashion. Better informed analysts already published it but here it seems that new group will be controlled by Exor with Peugeot family backing so that they will not need France or Dongfeng.

    Exor will jump close to Top 10 on Fortune Global 500.
     
  14. 77 Monaco Brougham

    77 Monaco Brougham Active Member

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    Thanks for the help. It's the first bit of positive news I've heard today
     
  15. Dave Z

    Dave Z It's me, Dave
    Staff Member Supporter

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    You can stop reading DeLorenzo with the first lie: “ After all, from the moment Marchionne was gifted FCA by the U.S. government...”

    That was one hell of an expensive gift - something over $5 billion for a company already seen as dead.

    Admittedly, most of the money came from Chrysler's operations, but only after Sergio & Co turned it around.

    ... and I will be the first to say that if Chrysler had been deeded to Magna by Daimler, it would not have NEEDED a bailout.

    I did read the whole thing. Agree 100% on Tesla, appreciate the Thanksgiving note, and agree with some of what he said but not the overall conclusions. There have been unions with corrupt leaders before and there will be again; the UAW obviously survived this and will continue. (You can see why the Canadians split off.) Sergio’s “evil” practices are different from Ford’s and GM’s how, now? The sales report thing was apparently in place before he started, and Chrysler has long manipulated its sales figures, going back to the 1970s as I recall. Doubt GM and Ford were totally innocent of that, either, especially as they raced to #1 in various fields — and Mercedes vs BMW vs Audi has its own examples, too. GM is just as guilty of FCA of the UAW scandal, as far as I can tell, and that really does seem to have been more about work rules and scheduling. And so on...

    “I interviewed someone who has axes to grind and was totally convinced, here's his argument in my words as the Final Say” is not a great work of journalism.
     
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  16. hmk123

    Level III Supporter

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    I am usually not into conspiracy theories but I can’t help that this is about more than meets the eye...
     
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  17. Stéphane Dumas

    Stéphane Dumas Well-Known Member

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    Don't forget India. PSA have a foot in the door.
    Ambassador To Return As PSA's EV Brand For India - CarandBike (at https://auto.ndtv.com/news/ambassador-to-return-as-psas-ev-brand-for-india-2015660 )

     
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  18. CNT900

    CNT900 Well-Known Member

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    I don't think this has anything to do with product. GM's contention is that FCA bribed the UAW to get better contracts with the UAW than GM did, and this was done in part to influence a FCA-GM merger. I was surprised to see GM go ahead with this lawsuit, but they seem to have a lot of evidence to support their case. This could get ugly.
     
  19. Beentherebefore

    Level III Supporter

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    It still will not be an easy case to prove;

    GM's 'nuclear' FCA racketeering suit difficult to prove (at https://www.detroitnews.com/story/business/autos/general-motors/2019/11/26/general-motors-nuclear-racketeering-suit-fiat-chrysler-difficult-prove/4259995002/ )

    Most of these types of cases are settled before going to trial. GM would probably settle for a few billion $$$ and call it even as they probably are envious that PSA turned their former European businesses profitable and GM likely figures that they may have sold for a few billion $$$ less than they should have now.

    I agree that it could get ugly if it ever gets to a jury trial. I've been around Chevy blowhards for over 60 years and any of them on a jury would enjoy giving thumbs down to Mopar. Lawyers for FCA should make it a requirement that anyone sitting on a jury is a foreign car owner/driver.
     
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  20. HotCarNut

    HotCarNut Defender of Reality
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    The problem with GM’s case, IMO, is that FCA was the LEAD in negotiations. That means that GM and Ford saw EXACTLY the deal that FCA negotiated and they’re pattern agreements. If GM got a worse deal, it’s their own fault as the FCA deal set the pattern. Had GM led the negotiations and THEN FCA got a better deal due to bribery of the UAW, then GM would have a legitimate gripe.

    The other fatal flaw for GM in regards to negotiating with the UAW is GM’s constantly falling plant and employment in the US. FCA did a much better job of guaranteeing and maintaining UAW jobs. So if FCA DID get a better deal than GM, FCA and the UAW can point to the job guarantees and performance since 2008 as the legitimate reason. Additionally, the UAW locals and workers ALL vote on each agreement. It isn’t like the UAW leadership can force them to take a bad deal, and we’ve seen the members vote against negotiated deals in each previous contract negotiation.

    Make no mistake, I think SM was up to his sweater and cigarettes in this. I just don’t think GM can prove that THEY were damaged by the scandal or that it was done to force a merger. Too many blatantly stupid missteps and bad decisions (both product and employment) by GM leadership that legitimately caused them to lose market share and UAW line worker support. That’s the crux of this: GM has to prove that the damage was due to FCA’s bribery of UAW leadership and not their own stupidity.
     

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