AF: GM to appeal after judge denies effort to revive racketeering suit against Fiat Chrysler | Page 2 | Allpar Forums
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GM to appeal after judge denies effort to revive racketeering suit against Fiat Chrysler

Discussion in 'Mopar / FCA News' started by T_690, Aug 14, 2020.

  1. Adventurer55

    Adventurer55 Well-Known Member

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    They also might be concerned that as a combined company GM themselves may become a takeover target.
     
  2. hmk123

    Level III Supporter

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    And that is where the story comes full circle? :)
     
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  3. Tomguy

    Tomguy Well-Known Member

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    Here's how I see it - and correct me if I'm wrong in this:

    • FCA bribed UAW officials to keep FCA worker costs down.
    • FCA did not bribe officials to keep GM's worker costs up (or if they did, there is no evidence of it).
    • If anything, GM benefitted as well, because contract workers could not say "FCA workers got X, Y and Z so we deserve it too!"
    Please do correct me, I am trying to dumb down as much as I can without going overboard or too in-depth, because this is essentially the very condensed summary of a lot of words and facts to "Talking points".

    If GM is claiming that costs saved by FCA somehow harmed GM that is a very, very long stretch that requires way more evidence than GM could possibly gather (it's speculation) and FCA could easily counter with point 3 in my list.
     
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  4. MJAB

    MJAB Well-Known Member

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    The drawers opps computers were empty of new technologies and programmed implementations, so much that PSA was willing to sue GM.

    Exclusive: PSA seeks Opel refund from GM over CO2 emissions (at https://www.reuters.com/article/us-peugeot-gm-opel-exclusive/exclusive-psa-seeks-opel-refund-from-gm-over-co2-emissions-idUSKBN1DT1NA )
     
  5. MJAB

    MJAB Well-Known Member

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    Well it the GM new "evidences" are maybe useful to make a movie script.
    There are two former FCA employees that than were working for GM, but in reality they were FCA's spies.
    Than they write that there were overseas FCA bank accounts, obviously secret to move money to pay all these people and they write that their investigators found acco8nt in Cayman, well ok maybe it could be good place, Switzerland uhmm maybe years years ago, now there is no more protection for individuals if information are requested by national authorities or other countries, and than You have Luxembourg, ... and Italy. In some of that countries, like Italy, all bank account have to be nominal, are always checked is all is traced.
    If I was someone willing to pay for something illecit for sure I would not use any european bank account, maybe pay in cash, gold, platinum or diamonds ... just to say.
    And if You want to do all legally, than giving a contract fo services, advices, ..., a high salary job to some family member of the "bad guys" using some "friend" company is what is usually done by companies with politics and high level persons in agencies when these person retire.

    Federal Judge Tosses Out GM Lawsuit Against FCA — Again | TheDetroitBureau.com (at https://www.thedetroitbureau.com/2020/08/federal-judge-tosses-out-gm-lawsuit-against-fca-again/ )
     
  6. Stéphane Dumas

    Stéphane Dumas Well-Known Member

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    Talk about karma bites back. :rolleyes:

    If GM became a takeover target and let's enter the world of "auto-fiction". We could imagine Renault in the aftermath of a divorce with Nissan (that's if they divorce) searching for a new partner who could be GM before Mahindra or a Chinese comglomerate do (that's if the current floods in China don't go worse and force China to focus on other priorities).
     
  7. Beentherebefore

    Level III Supporter

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    Thanks for that. I'd never heard about it before. Doesn't surprise me one bit. Did PSA ever get anything from GM after getting screwed by them?
     
  8. 68RT

    68RT Well-Known Member

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    I believe that they got the best revenge. Opel showing a profit. GM has not shown good GENERAL MANAGEMENT for a long time.
     
  9. 77 Monaco Brougham

    77 Monaco Brougham Well-Known Member

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    Actually, I was thinking along fairly similar lines.

    This GM lawsuit saga is starting to remind me way too much of Larry Hagman's relentless vendetta against business competitor Ken Kercheval on the old soap opera 'DALLAS'::p:D

    View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNe_4Pfa7yA
     
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  10. KrisW

    KrisW Well-Known Member

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    Opel lost money every single year for the two decades leading to its sale to PSA. That period covered two long car sales booms in the European market: it takes a special kind of management to lose money in a market like that. Two years under PSA was enough to turn a profit.

    The other example of GM's brilliance is FIAT: FIAT had been on track to eventually merge with GM until 2004, but after the companies went their separate ways, the re-organised FIAT became so profitable that just five years later it was able to make a successful bid for taking Chrysler out of bankruptcy. At the same time, FIAT had also pitched to the German government to take over Opel in 2009 when GM Europe asked for state aid, and was in the top two contenders (although the other offer, by Magna, was considered the favorite at the time), but then GM backtracked and took Opel off the market.
     
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  11. freshforged

    freshforged Well-Known Member

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    you can tell he's a Texan 'cause the hat
     
  12. CNT900

    CNT900 Well-Known Member

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    I think GM was stupid for holding on to Opel/Vauxhall as long as they did. And, I rather doubt PSA will make any real money with it unless they close half of it down and rebadge a bunch of Pugs and Fiats to sell as Opels and Vauxhalls. And none of that will go over well. FCA+PSA represents a lot of overlap, it will take years to sort it all out. Hopefully, Chrysler will remain profitable to fund it all.....

    BTW, this guy look familiar?

    https://i0.wp.com/www.curbsideclassic.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/Bob-Lutz-Opel.jpg
     
  13. KrisW

    KrisW Well-Known Member

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    Opel is already profitable under PSA’s ownership, and it’s not really rebadging, as much as extensive architecture sharing: the Opel vehicles don’t look like their Peugeot cousins until you get into the engine bay or look underneath. To a customer, they’re very different offerings.

    The combined FIAT+PSA+Opel will pay its own way in Europe. FIAT's issues in Europe are well discussed, but as a summary, they lack a couple of models in the biggest segments in Europe (PSA has an architecture for these, and will be supplying FIAT with at least one them - this will happen regardless of when the merger occurs), and they have poor distribution and sales infrastructure in Northern Europe.

    In terms of corporate structure, FCA US doesn’t fund FCA Italy: money made in each division stays in that division. FCA Italy has covered its losses and funded its development by sale of assets (e.g., its stake in Ferrari, Magneti Marelli).
     
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  14. 77 Monaco Brougham

    77 Monaco Brougham Well-Known Member

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    One would hope that the future Stell/\ntis would have better taste than to go anywhere near GM.:D
     
    #34 77 Monaco Brougham, Aug 25, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2020
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  15. Adventurer55

    Adventurer55 Well-Known Member

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    I hope that plan is adopted across the new company. That way all regions can taylor their products to meet their needs. Same stuff underneath, but on the outside the look and features to fit the various needs.
     
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  16. MJAB

    MJAB Well-Known Member

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    But is already like that, in some regions You have products that cannot be found in other regions as well as powertrains.
    Also options that one doesn't find in other regions. For example why steering wheel paddle shifters for Jeep Renegade and Compass are available in (at least) one region and not for the others? Why Fiat Toro / Ram 1000 is avaible only in LATAM region?
     
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  17. Adventurer55

    Adventurer55 Well-Known Member

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    I understand what you're saying and I don't get that either. I guess I was talking more about future products. I hope they are able to see the value of their brands, and hope they utilize them wisely. Common architecture that is modular enough to adapt to their various regions. I don't think wasting money trying to relaunch Peugeot here is wise. How about giving Chrysler a right sized CUV for this market? Remember FCA didn't even notice the 200's biggest flaw until it was too late. Not enough room in the back seat. How did they miss that?
     
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  18. Dave Z

    Dave Z It's me, Dave
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    If I had to guess, I would say Sergio, who adored Steve Jobs, took on Steve's idea that market research is not as useful as one great leader's tastes.

    Worked for Steve 70% of the time. Didn't work so well for Sergio with the Dart 1.4T or 200 or USA Renegade. Worked pretty well with the Cherokee and EU Renegade.
     
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  19. Adventurer55

    Adventurer55 Well-Known Member

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    Well hopefully, if the Chrysler brand gets another product, they will research it this time.
     
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  20. 77 Monaco Brougham

    77 Monaco Brougham Well-Known Member

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    My memory might be a little fuzzy on this one, but wasn't the original plan for Renegade to be mostly marketed in countries outside the US?

    If that's the case, then I would consider Renegade to be a success.
     

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