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Jeep and Dodge delay new models

Discussion in 'Mopar / FCA News' started by Erik Latranyi, Jun 2, 2015.

  1. Mopartial

    Mopartial Fits and Finishes

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    So why would half of them buy a Dodge Grand Caravan when they could have the (better equipped) Chrysler T&C?
     
  2. CarSalesBill

    CarSalesBill Active Member

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    They can make and probably will make Chrysler tall wagons as well as more rugged and capable SUV's being Jeeps. If the Compass and the Jeepster didn't kill Jeep, then I think a 3 row Grand Cherokee wouldn't do them in either. I think Jeep can have a two aspect marketing strategy of making capable all weather vehicles and with more rugged off road halo versions like the Trailhawks.

    I asked the 8 salespeople on duty this evening if they would rather have a Durango to sell or a 3rd row Grand Cherokee and all enthusiastically preferred the Jeep.

    BTW, dana44, it was a cheap shot because it was personal and implied professional weakness on my part. You don't know me and my sales abilities.
     
  3. Stratuscaster

    Stratuscaster Vaguely badass...
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    Maybe it's time for folks to quit treating the Dodge brand like it's "damaged goods" and put forth the effort to promote it and the changes that have been made since that guy's neighbor had an inferior Durango years ago. I can tell you that the first thing that pops into my mind when I think Dodge is NOT "Al Bundy". Maybe we can quit pushing such things ourselves.

    Yes, perceptions are difficult to change - but that doesn't mean you don't try. "The Dodge Durango has improved quite a bit since then. While Jeep doesn't currently offer a 3-row vehicle, the Grand Cherokee does share it's underpinnings with the new Dodge Durango that does offer 3-row seating. It also offers similar powertrains, and the V8 AWD model actually gets 2 MPG highway more than the Grand Cherokee and 4 MPG more than the old Durango. You should really give it a test drive and see how much better it is."

    Yes, you will get folks that simply will not buy a Dodge, no matter what. You get that with every brand. Even Jeep.

    You'll get your 3-row Jeep in a couple years. Keep those contacts and let them know. Then you can bring them back and call them "conquest sales from another brand."
     
  4. Stratuscaster

    Stratuscaster Vaguely badass...
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    I'd venture to say, based upon my own observations, that Jeep is simply an easier sell. Not surprising.
     
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  5. Int

    Int Active Member

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    But it's not that long ago that putting the Jeep name on volume vehicles was to guarantee failure. Any brand name can fall or rise.
     
  6. Stratuscaster

    Stratuscaster Vaguely badass...
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    Which makes the point that "damaged" brands can be revived.
     
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  7. Int

    Int Active Member

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    Or even dead ones. No where is it chipped into stone that this cannot be.
     
  8. CarSalesBill

    CarSalesBill Active Member

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    I like the Durango a lot and do everything I can to promote it but it's far easier to sell a Grand Cherokee. Because of our quirky way of selling cars we ask people what they want instead of showing them what we have and they ask for 3 row Jeeps everyday. When you say Durango they want to leave. You have to show them first before you tell them it's a Dodge and then you have a uphill struggle even when they oh and ah on the test drive and show them the good ranking in Consumer Reports and show the article that the head tester at CR drives a Durango. I try real hard.
     
    #668 CarSalesBill, Jul 17, 2015
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2015
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  9. dana44

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    Yes, it was a cheap shot, something you can look at as not something I do on even an occasional basis, but it was done based on your comments. I do not know you or your sales abilities, which is why I mentioned a week rental or borrow from a company to see if the people would like it if it were free (for the cost of a full tank of gas when returned), some way to get a person to try the Durango instead of blowing you off because it is a Dodge, and going elsewhere for something that fits their needs simply because they have been told the Durango isn't good and you couldn't prove (the rental/borrow/tank of gas) is a good vehicle even if it doesn't say Jeep on the hood. Part of a salesman's job is not to sucker others into something they don't want, but persuade them to at least try something new, without pressure, then make up their own mind, so yeah, Dodge and Chrysler, including the FWD Jeeps, have all been dumbed down, softened up, gone from their roots, cheapened over time, and it didn't get us anything but a Fiat CEO and three majorly delayed vehicles that are needed just to keep up with the competition, not beat them.
     
  10. CDJSalesPro

    CDJSalesPro Allpar Legacy

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    I am sorry but some of you have been way too hard on CarsalesBill. He has only spoken the truth and in my opinion he is 100% correct. There is no doubt in my mind that a 3 row SUV with the JEEP name will outsell Durango. In the United States "JEEP" is synonymous with SUV. That's not the sales peoples fault its what JEEP does .......they build SUV's. !!! That is also why you will never see a JEEP minivan....That's not JEEP that's Chrysler or Dodge....

    The Durango is a fine SUV ....but the Citadel is still not equal to a Grand Cherokee Overland or Summit when it comes to luxury. That's not just perception that's reality...... No Durango offers...real wood interior trim, Suede headliners, Noise canceling technology and more. More importantly the Dodge name has no luxury brand "snob appeal" Thousands of Mercedes, Audi', BMW's,Range Rovers , Cadillac and Lexus have been traded in for Grand Cherokee Overlands and Summits over the last half decade.. Jeep has earned its reputation. Articles like the Motortrend comparison where the GC went up against Porsche ,Mercedes and VW and won. http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/suvs/1307_luxury_diesel_suv_comparison/viewall.html
    Like it or not Jeep has a reputation for building a fine SUV....Dodge has no such reputation.


    Its the same silly argument that many here on this board claimed that the KL should have been and could have been a Dodge. It could .......if you wanted it to sell 100k units instead 280k per year. Will there ever be a two door Hemi powered rwd muscle car with the JEEP name on it? Of course not!!!


    You guys have no idea how often we hear "does JEEP make a 3 row vehicle?" Yes we try to show them the Durango. and sometimes they become a sale. But CarsalesBill is 100% correct that it will be easier to offer the customer a product that they WANT and have actually asked for instead being SOLD(I know that's a dirty word on this board) something that they might not want or have not considered.
     
  11. CDJSalesPro

    CDJSalesPro Allpar Legacy

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  12. JKU12

    JKU12 Well-Known Member

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    The original arguments were not Jeep is a better or easier sell than Dodge. They were, we should stretch the GC and offer two versions of it. Points were just thrown against the wall.

    Personally I would rather see a real 3 row in a large Wagoneer, rather than a compromised stretched uncomfortable GC 3 row.
     
  13. Stratuscaster

    Stratuscaster Vaguely badass...
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    One thing we know for a fact is that you can wish and hope for a 3-row Jeep right now, but you won't get one right now.

    I don't believe that I ever said a 3-row Jeep would or would not outsell a Durango. My point has been that you have a product that does meet most of your consumer's requirements in the Durango, except for a Jeep badge.

    I also noted that I do agree that a Jeep SUV is an easier sell than a Dodge SUV. I've been in sales, I have an understanding of having to overcome consumers that hear just enough to think they know what they want while putting blinders on to anything else - regardless of the fact that "what they want" is sitting right there in front of them. People believe what they wish, facts be damned.

    I simply do not agree that a 3-row Grand Cherokee is the way to go about resolving this issue. It would almost be too easy to simply have dropped the Durango, put the Grand Cherokee front fascia, badging, and interior on it, and bring out the Grand Grand Cherokee, or Grand Cherokee Plus, or heck - even call it Wagoneer just to get the name established. One has to ask "why didn't they" if the demand for a 3-row Jeep is that high. My initial thought is that the Durango serves as an alternative for Dodge buyers that don't want a Grand Caravan and also don't want a Jeep. I guess it's a matter of which consumers do you want to alienate more - Jeep or Dodge buyers?


    It's 2015. The last we heard is that the new Grand Cherokee - and the Wagoneer - would be pushed back until 2018. That's 3 years. I think, if I were a salesperson, I'd figure out how to get my consumer looking for a 3-row Jeep into a 36-month lease on a Dodge Durango so they can come back to me and pick up that brand new 3-row Jeep Wagoneer in 3 years. But that's me and how I think.
     
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  14. Ian

    Ian Car Freak

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    To each is own. I have a Durango and I don't use the 3rd row seat. If you ask me to pick between my 2006 Durango Limited and a 2006 GC Limited, I would still take the Durango.

    Forward to 2015, I prefer the Durango over the Grand Cherokee just because I like the Dodge styling better. Same goes for the minivan, I don't care how nice a T&C is, I will take a G-Caravan Crew or R/T instead.
     
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  15. CarSalesBill

    CarSalesBill Active Member

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    I recall reading somewhere, Sergio wanted to have the Durango be a Jeep as he thinks all SUV's should be Jeeps but it was too far along in development to change. The Jeep purists and Dodge fans thus have had an experiment that proves Sergio right. The Jefferson North factory would be more profitable if it built all Jeeps and would also have a higher share of more profitable 3 row SUV's.

    Believe me, I'm very cognizant of selling out of stock, maximizing what you have available. I do a very good demo and walk around on Durangos. I'm just saying to the faithful, don't complain when the Durango goes away in the next redo and a 3 row Grand Cherokee comes rolling out in it's place. It's just about the bottom line
     
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  16. Zagnut27

    Zagnut27 Jeepaholic

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    I understand where the car sales guys are coming from. As salesmen, you want to give your customers what they want...that's a no brainer. And like some have said, when someone has it in their head what they "want", it can be extremely difficult to get them to focus more on what they "need". And I think this is where effective marketing comes into play. Jeep sells a certain "lifestyle" that is associated with their vehicles that people fall in love with, and I don't think Dodge has done as effective a job as they could have. The Durango is a wonderful vehicle, and there really isn't a good reason why they don't sell better than they do, and I think a lot of that is related to how it is marketed.

    And I whole heartedly agree that Jeep should offer a 3-row SUV...call it whatever you want. But where Jeep needs to be careful is that it MUST have Jeep capability. All Jeeps are SUV's, but not all SUV's are Jeeps. For instance, my wife has a Buick Encore. It's a nice little vehicle, but even if you slapped a 7-slot grill on it, and a Jeep badge it would NEVER be considered a real Jeep. It's not rugged enough. I drove over a curb, and the darn AWD shut off! I'm not sure my Liberty has ever even noticed running over a curb before....lol. I don't think all Jeeps necessarily need to have the same capability as a Wrangler, however, I do believe there should be a full portfolio of vehicles in the Jeep lineup that share that level (or better) of capability. That is what will keep the Jeep "lifestyle" alive, and not turn them into just another SUV brand...because once they are just like everyone else, what then is the allure of buying a Jeep? It's that perception of capability that sells Jeeps...what happens to that perception (and sales numbers) when the capability is no longer there? I WANT you to have all the Jeeps you can sell, and to get filthy rich off of those sales because that means my beloved Jeep is doing well, but I want them to be the best Jeeps they can be.

    A last thought...I remember reading recently that once upon a time, Buicks were sports cars for rich people (or something like that). Really? The frumpy car that grandpa Joe drives? We don't want Jeep to become the brand that once upon a time sold off-road capable vehicles, but nobody remembers that history. Sorry, this is a bit long...I'll get down off my soap box now. :)
     
  17. Wow I could've sworn that it was changed into a Durango at the last moment. I believe the Durango was originally the new Commander. The plan was not to kill the truck based Durango, but move it to another assembly plant, which did not happen. Then the Commander was morphed into a Durango.
     
  18. dana44

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    Wasn't there a really big sales boom on the Durango when there were Ron Burgandy commercials? I haven't seen a Durango, Dart or 200/300, heck, the only commercials I see are Dodge Ram trucks and Jeeps. Dodge car and Chrysler commercials are non-existent, which doesn't help.
     
  19. TheMan

    TheMan What color are the clouds in your world?
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    Yes, the plant change did happen. It moved from Dodge City in Warren, Michigan, to JNAP (Jefferson Avenue) in Detroit.
     
    #679 TheMan, Jul 18, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 18, 2015
  20. Stratuscaster

    Stratuscaster Vaguely badass...
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    Since we're all throwing out opinions - the Durango is the best 3-row SUV that no one is buying.

    (And by "no one" I mean "very few.")

    I know of at least two friends that went Jeep-shopping and left with Durangos.
     
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