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PSA will be merged into FCA

Discussion in 'Mopar / FCA News' started by T_690, Feb 26, 2020.

  1. Stéphane Dumas

    Stéphane Dumas Well-Known Member

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    One user on GMInsidenews forums (where I mentionned this news) also suspect then Renault could have played a role in this since they was beaten in the finish line by Peugeot.
     
  2. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    Meanwhile, Nissan N.A. announced that it is pulling the plug on its full-size NV2500 van. Nissan ready to concede on vans

    Nissan spent a fortune and many years trying to break into the NA commercial van market. Ford holds a lock on it with 50% of sales, followed by GM, Ram and Daimler. Nissan made handsome margins on its full-size vans, but competed mostly on price. Despite much effort, sales only nibbled at the margins of the segment. The full-size NV van was based on first-generation Titan underpinnings; my guess is Nissan looked at the tab involved in updating it and figured money is better spent elsewhere.

    Nissan also produces the much more competitive NV Urvan, which no doubt it must be looking to bring to NA at some point.

    [​IMG]
     
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  3. Deckard_Cain

    Deckard_Cain Active Member

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    A lot of countries love to kick Italy, and other Southern European countries. Freaking hypocrites. That makes my blood boil so I'll just avoid going into that, because you already explained. Lets just say that the Netherlands are hypocrites. They're a fiscal paradise and then adopt a holier than thou posture against other european countries.
     
    Stéphane Dumas and T_690 like this.
  4. Adventurer55

    Adventurer55 Well-Known Member

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    And where does that leave the dismal Titan? All that money spent on the truck that was said to really take on Ram and hardly a threat at all. Wasn't that Diaz's baby at one time?
     
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  5. MJAB

    MJAB Well-Known Member

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    Well the European Commission is always prone to promote north european acquisitions/mergers, not the opposite.
    One of last excample is opposition to acquisition by italian company Fincantieri of the Chantiers de l’Atlantique (former Stx France) that was sold by a South Korea tribunal.
    At same time the french government was making the deal with italian one (Fincantieri is italian state owned), the same french where joining Germany to appeal at EU competition commission against the acquisition of the 50% (it was 51%, but french president Macron, after his election, didn't finalized the deal even if his predecessor had signed it).

    With french government You never know what they do in the shadow. Maybe ar ethem backing the EU commissions, even if they are shareholders in PSA and Renault.
    The big "but" is that in Renault they have the control of the company, in the new company (FCA-PSA), the control will be in the hands of Agnelli and Peugeot families.

    If I was in Exor (Agnelli) I would spinoff Fiat Professional and merge with Iveco/FTP Professional (that is planned to be split from CNH Industrial).
    In that way they will go back at pre FCA/PSA merger condition.

    Fiat Professional already has an indipendent retail network, the assembly plants of most of the vehicles are two joint ventures, one Sevel Sud for the Ducato and one with Tofas for Doblò / Fiorino.
    Even for the powertrains, till now most of Ducato diesel engines are sourced by FTP Industrial (there is a plan to change it in few years switching to FCA plant of Pratola Serra).
     
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  6. CivoLee

    CivoLee Well-Known Member

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    I would LOVE to see a return of cabover vans to North America, but I can see it getting a lot of pushback from safety groups ("Your legs are the crumple zone!").
     
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  7. freshforged

    freshforged Well-Known Member

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    How about a modified COE, where the wheels are still (ever so slightly) ahead of the cab, but the traction motor (not i.c.e) is under or slightly behind the drivers seat? Given the low-maintenance aspect of electric motors this config makes tons of sense.
     
  8. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    Yes it was. More recently, Diaz was put in charge of Mitsubishi US. He must be back in Nashville now.

    Good question. The full-size NV van was created precisely to utilize Titan’s plant capacity better. With Titan sales still marginal, despite all the investment Nissan has poured into it, and NV now gone, where does that leave that entire vehicle architecture....?

    Wouldn’t be surprised if Nissan brings Patrol/Armada/QX80/Titan into one common platform.
     
  9. tabutler

    tabutler Active Member

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    Wasn't the last generation Armada/QX80 on the same platform as the Titan? I believe that it was switched to the Patrol's platform (Rebadge) for this generation. Moving them to a common platform would make sense.
     
  10. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    Yes.
     
  11. MJAB

    MJAB Well-Known Member

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  12. freshforged

    freshforged Well-Known Member

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  13. 77 Monaco Brougham

    77 Monaco Brougham Well-Known Member

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    A couple of days ago, I would have disagreed with your theory about there being petty politics, hypocricy, and favoritism of Northern Europe vs. Southern Europe by the EU.

    Not any more... The developments of today by the so-called "competition commission" have been enough to swing me over to your side of the argument.
     
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  14. Stéphane Dumas

    Stéphane Dumas Well-Known Member

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    The plot thickens.

    VAG and Ford might play to role to block the FCA-PSA merger but as I mentionned earlier let's not forget Renault who might still have a grudge against Peugeot after they've been outsmarted by them when they tried to approach Fiat. Renault and Peugeot rivalry in France is similar to the GM and Ford rivalry.
     
  15. 77 Monaco Brougham

    77 Monaco Brougham Well-Known Member

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    The longer this thing drags out...the worse it stinks...which puts me in mind of an old Portuguese Folk Proverb:

    The more you stir the manure pile, the more it smells
     
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  16. KrisW

    KrisW Well-Known Member

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    VW-Ford is nothing special in the European van market. It's a pooled investment for a common product that each maker will sell competitively. It's exactly the arrangement that FCA, GM and PSA had for the Doblo, or FCA and PSA have at present for the Ducato.

    Don't think it means that VW and Ford are pursuing a merger, or that they're suddenly going to stop competing with each other.

    I'm not happy about anything that would delay the PSA-FCA merger, but the European Commission is entirely correct to refer it to anti-trust investigators. The combined company will become the dominant player in the European light commercial vehicle market, and that could be bad for customers. I want to see FCA do well, but I want that to happen through good product, not market manipulation.

    Consider if GM was to acquire Toyota's pickup truck business - would you expect FCA and Ford to sit back and say "yup. Fine with that"? This is the same situation. Any competitor has an obligation to their own shareholders to raise concerns about this merger.
     
  17. T_690

    T_690 Well-Known Member

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    @KrisW

    Yet again I disagree. 35% vs 33% is not big difference from the manufacturing standpoint.

    Not to mention that PSA on various markets has brands which can compete against each other. Sales channel is not merged.
     
  18. KrisW

    KrisW Well-Known Member

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    @T_690

    I'm not saying that there's a real problem with the merger in terms of LCVs, and I'm not saying it should be blocked. It's the job of the EU's Competition Directorate to investigate any merger that has a potential to create an anti-competitive situation in the market. FCA-PSA being referred to the directorate shouldn't be a surprise, given the size of the post-merger company's LCV market-share. If there wasn't an investigation, then I would definitely suspect political interference.

    I think that VW and Ford's partnership will be the reason why I don't expect any penalty for FCA and PSA - Ford and VW may end up with a combined purchasing and manufacturing capacity that's larger than the combined FCA-PSA entity, and that will negate any claim that the merged company will have an unchallenged position in the market.
     
  19. Adventurer55

    Adventurer55 Well-Known Member

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    From an outsiders prospective, it appears the regulators are doing their job. Unlike here in the states, where they just rubber stamp mergers.
     
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