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Wrangler on the road

Discussion in 'Mopar News' started by Dave Z, Jul 31, 2017.

  1. Ruptured Duck

    Ruptured Duck Active Member

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    JK hard top is nothing more than a fiberglass shell. Not the same as a true fixed (integrated) hard top. In this argument the fiberglass hard top offers nothing over the standard soft top.

    Funny.... @DarkSky and I must have been typing at the same moment.
     
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  2. redriderbob

    redriderbob Mopar Guru!
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    I always wondered that too, considering my 2000 and 2003 Durangos had the 4.7L and were underpowered compared to the 3.6L. I think part of it has to do with the way the suspension setup is in the Wrangler JK 4x4 models.
     
  3. Chase300

    Chase300 Active Member

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    LOL! Well as you can see I know little overall on the Jeep Wrangler features other than they are 4wd.
    I still believe the Unlimited tow rating is artificially low but do think the standard Wrangler @ 3,500 is realistic.
     
  4. GasAxe

    GasAxe Well-Known Member

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    The irony in your comment is remarkable. What makes you believe Jeep would purposefully put the Wrangler at a market disadvantage? All the technical reasons have been given for why the tow rating is what it is.
     
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  5. 68RT

    68RT Well-Known Member

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    The Durango did not have a suspension designed for extreme travel required for off roading that a wrangler must be equipped for. That and a short wheelbase in the standard Jeep accounts for a lot of the difference. Have you ever followed a Wrangler going down a rough road compared to say a Durango on the same road?
     
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  6. Chase300

    Chase300 Active Member

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    What technical reasons??? All conjecture so far that I've read.
    Here is why I feel its low on the Unlimited.
    A wheelbase that is almost 21" longer along with 600+ weight gives it an advantage handling tongue weight along with tow weight even if its just 500lbs over a short wheelbase Wrangler....even if its just 250 lbs!
    Until a FCA Jeep Engineer comes on and says, Yes, we tested the Unlimited and it could not safely tow 1 more pound that the Wrangler I stand by the believe it was rubber stamped.
    I'm sure that came from Marketing noting that customers don't have a high interest or priority in the tow rating.
     
  7. Stomper

    Stomper Well-Known Member

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    So you gave your conjecture as to why you believe the JKU has an artificially low tow rating. Others on this board with experience in the automotive field have given technical reasons, their "conjecture", as to why the rating is the way it is. Take each for what it is worth.
     
  8. link3721

    link3721 Yes, This MK Goes Off-Road
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    You say it like the tow rating is arbitrary as opposed to following a set testing procedure (SAE probably) to determine the maximum load the vehicle can safely pull. They ran the test and said "hey, looks like we can give it this rating and still meet all of our other off-road capability requirements". Now you come in and say "now let's make it tow more" and the engineers respond "and lose our off-road capability? You're crazy!"

    To make it tow more, either off-road capability must decrease (not a practical option) or money must be spent to increase durability of the necessary parts (not desirable to the bean counters or most consumers). Towing is not that high on the priority list.

    If you want Wrangler capability with towing, the JT may offer what you seek.
     
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  9. WXman

    WXman Active Member

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    Drive ANY convertible into a U-Haul store and ask to rent a large trailer. See what they tell you.

    The fact that Wrangler is a high center of gravity 4x4 with a convertible top makes it "dangerous" to a certain degree already (compared to other SUVs). Now throw in the fact that Wrangler hitches bolt only to a single crossmember, not down two frame rails like other trucks in the competition. Now throw in the fact that Wrangler has flexy suspension. If you're an engineer working on the tow/haul program you're scared to death now.

    The Wrangler driveline is MORE than able to tow 5,000 lbs. or even 7,500 lbs. It's all the stuff around that driveline that prevents it from getting bigger ratings. And I suspect that tow ratings on JL will go up by a small margin, but not by a large one.
     
  10. 68RT

    68RT Well-Known Member

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    Conjecture on my part: Frame strength may be a large part of the equation.
     
  11. Chase300

    Chase300 Active Member

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    I fully understand towing would be way low on the list compared to off-road capability and 100% agree with that.
    What I just found hard to understand was how the short wheelbase Wrangler could have the EXACT same tow rating as a longer, heavier Unlimited.
    The suspension argument can't be the reason.
     
  12. Chase300

    Chase300 Active Member

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    I'm sure even not towing the 600 lb heavier, 20.5" longer wheelbase, 15" longer Unlimited is more stable at highway speed than a Wrangler.
    Someone want to confirm that?
     
  13. GasAxe

    GasAxe Well-Known Member

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    Ask yourself this, does the Unlimited have different brakes, suspension, cooling capacity, torque, or horsepower from the JK? Sound to me the increased length for towing is off-set by everything else needing to move a larger vehicle.

    Read this link to gain some understanding of suspension designs. SUV suspension design (at http://www.allpar.com/ed/suv-suspensions.html ) It doesn't specifically talk about towing, but it shows the depth which engineers take to create suspensions for vehicles. Apply that depth of knowledge to towing and you'll begin to see how your conclusions are woefully mistaken.
     
  14. aldo90731

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    The short wheelbase of the 2-door Wrangler makes for squiggly handling in normal driving conditions; I can only imagine what it must do in towing situations.
     
    #114 aldo90731, Aug 10, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2017
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  15. MJAB

    MJAB Well-Known Member

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    Most of the answer, not the cause, has to do with rear axle capacity and allowed gross weight and combined weight of the vehicle.

    Look at rear axle gross axle weight rating, than subtract rear curb weight.
    Than there are the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating and Gross Combined Weight Rating, that are the allowed maximum limits for the vehicles.
    Since also there is the driver :), the fuel, maybe passengers, ... the residual weight is less.

    The recommended tongue weight, if I am not wrong, in U.S.A. should be about 10% of trailer total weight.

    (the numbers are from one of online car databases)

    Note also that Gross Axle Weight Rating (5975.00 lbs) is higher than Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (5500 lbs), not unusual since there are other parts, for example the frame, that has to put into account.
    The limit to take into account is the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating, 5500 lbs.

    2017 Jeep Wrangler Sahara

    Trim Curb Weight : lbs 4397.00
    Standard Weight - Front : lbs 0
    Standard Weight - Rear : lbs 0
    Base Trim Weight - Front : lbs 2273.00
    Base Trim Weight - Rear : lbs 2124.00
    Gross Axle Wt Rating - Front : lbs 2775
    Gross Axle Wt Rating - Rear : lbs 3200
    Curb Weight - Front : lbs 2273
    Curb Weight - Rear : lbs 2124
    Option Weight - Front : lbs 0.00
    Option Weight - Rear : lbs 0.00
    Reserve Axle Capacity - Front : lbs 502.00
    Reserve Axle Capacity - Rear : lbs 1076.00
    As Spec'd Curb Weight : lbs 4397.00
    As Spec'd Payload : lbs 1103.00
    Maximum Payload Capacity : lbs 1103.00
    Gross Combined Wt Rating : lbs 6547
    Gross Axle Weight Rating : lbs 5975.00
    Curb Weight : lbs 4397.00
    Reserve Axle Capacity : lbs 1578.00
    Gross Vehicle Weight Rating : lbs 5500.00
     
    #115 MJAB, Aug 10, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2017
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  16. Ruptured Duck

    Ruptured Duck Active Member

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    I owned a 2012 Rubicon 2dr. From 2007 - then it was always lower for the 2dr.

    JK Unlimited - 3500
    JK Dr - 2000

    To @Chase300 point what changed? Go to the Jeep website and click on the 2dr - 3500, click on the 4dr unlimited - 3500.
    Jeep Capabilities - Towing Capacity Chart (at https://www.jeep.com/en/jeep-capabilities/towing/#Wrangler4Tab* )

    Did I miss something ( i am getting older and its been a crappy day), or is the website having a little issue?

    Self Editing: Looks like the change happened last year. 2016 owners manual states the two door and four door Wranglers have 3500 lbs. towing rating IF you have 3.73 or 4.10 gear ratios... and they are equipped with Class II tow hitch.
     
    #116 Ruptured Duck, Aug 10, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2017
  17. link3721

    link3721 Yes, This MK Goes Off-Road
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    Possibly they made trailer sway standard on all Wranglers? That could've boosted the 2 door rating.
     

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