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WTF is going on at FCA?

Discussion in 'Mopar / FCA News' started by aldo90731, Jul 20, 2020.

  1. 68RT

    68RT Well-Known Member

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    It appears that the tire is not very stressed on the Gladiator. At 35psi, they are god for over 7,000 pounds if weight is equal and that figure would take in heat. 32 psi of course is not on the chart. That makes it an unknown and what if it gets loaded at that psi.
     
  2. 68RT

    68RT Well-Known Member

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    The Cooper tires do have a slight bit of ride height difference and possibly a different sidewall flex rate and that could make a big difference when close to being off perfect settings.
     
  3. CherokeeVision

    CherokeeVision Well-Known Member

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    The door sticker is for original tires. At tire replacement it is really only a starting point at setting pressure.
    Things like temperature rating, weight rating, etc are legitimate variables for adjusting pressure.
     
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  4. hmk123

    Level III Supporter

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    I was just browsing through the latest MotorTrend (August) and there was a longterm update on their Wrangler Rubicon EcoDiesel and the author commented how steering had been an issue with previous JLs he drove. That long distance trips could be tiring but that this new Wrangler didn’t seem to have this problem anymore. Wrote he inquired within Jeep and they told him that both steering gear valve tuning and pump calibration changes had been made.
     
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  5. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    Yeah, FCA has been saying that they “fixed” the steering for 2020...but judging by the number of owners still having the issue, there’s zero evidence that they in fact have fixed anything.
     
    #225 aldo90731, Aug 1, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2020
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  6. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    This popped up last night on the other Wrangler forum:

    —Edited for brevity—

    Hi all, second Wrangler here. My 2019 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon JL has 12K miles on it since new. Two months ago, the vehicle exhibited massive failures of what seems to be electrical issues. While driving at highway speeds, the electronic throttle warning came on, the antiskid, vehicle stability control, check engine light, among others came on. This also happened while driving on a twisty mountain road in the Sierras, and the steering went stiff, the engine reduced power nearly causing a bad accident. The vehicle has been in for this issue 5 times now... Frankly, I don't feel safe driving it... I've contacted Chrysler FCA several times now. My case manager elevated the case to dispute resolution, but they kicked it back to her. Now she's too busy to call me or talk about the issue. We have been without our Jeep now for going on six weeks. Extremely disappointed at FCA's lack of response or technical help to the dealer who has been working on it, or is trying to anyway. Oh, and they just got another one in with the same problem, it would seem that this is an engineering design error in the JL So beware, this vehicle could kill you if this happens. Pull off the road and call a tow truck. And don't expect FCA to help you with the problem. Probably going to have to go the legal route to get this resolved.

    —JLemon
    The frequency with which these types of posts are popping up is astonishing.

    Sounds like JeepCares has its hands full.
     
  7. hmk123

    Level III Supporter

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    My fear is that modern cars are becoming such integrated systems you change one part and it impacts another. I remember watching a YouTuber who had some issues with his 911 and the dealer believed that a certain updated electronics module they had to replace in his 911 had new side effects with his “revision” of the car. I am really not sure if software development methodologies lend itself to cars...
     
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  8. gforce2002

    gforce2002 Well-Known Member

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    Yep, the one I drove was a 2020 and it exhibited the same behaviour as everyone's been talking about. That this has been going on for three model years is crazy.
     
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  9. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    Indeed, vehicles are becoming more complex.

    But the hope is that vehicle reliability improves with each passing year. Right now, it seems newer JLs have more problems than those built in 2018, not less.

    Not that 2018 JLs were the epitome of quality; they had frame welds separating and other bizarre problems. But the number of 2019, and now 2020, JLs developing serious electrical problems, some as soon as they drive off the lot, three years into JL’s production cycle, is mind boggling.
     
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  10. Adventurer55

    Adventurer55 Well-Known Member

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    I've been looking at new Ram 1500s. We originally were headed towards a Durango, but we recently repowered our Commander and it's in good shape and my wife loves her Jeep. Therefore I'm going to sell my 2002 Ram 2500 Quad Cab Cummins that I've had since new. With that said, I'm going to wait until after the merger and see what Mr. Tavares does at Auburn Hills before I buy. Too many things are popping up recently makes me uncomfortable buying now. I am most impressed how he was able to return Opel to profitablity when the "mighty" GM wasn't, which translates, at least to me of a rampant bubble mentality surrounding the American auto companies. Let the customer be the test dummy for new systems, just like the 70s emissions debacles. I've waited 18 years for a new truck, a bit longer won't do me in unless the covid does. Lol
     
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  11. Adventurer55

    Adventurer55 Well-Known Member

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    View: https://youtu.be/qQJ06VcogB0

    Opinions?
    If this has been posted please remove.
     
  12. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    Couple comments:
    1. A number of aftermarket fabricators have issued some sort of "correction" for JL steering. Symergy is the most common. The jury is still out whether it does anything.
    2. Why are aftermarket fabricators coming up with hardware "fixes" while FCA keeps screwing around with flashes, steering dampers and more re-flashes...?
    The best “remedy” seems to be to buy a Jeep that doesn’t wander; even if you have to test drive a whole bunch and visit several dealers. For anyone stuck with a loose steering, the ability to successfully rectify it appears to be under 50%.
     
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  13. plymouth1

    plymouth1 Well-Known Member

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    I was going to post this but see you had already. Exactly right. Ford got what they asked for from Firestone and then tried to blame Firestone. Firestone should have been smart enough to tell them the tire wouldn't perform well on such a heavy vehicle. Greed is a terrible thing
     
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  14. valiant67

    valiant67 ...

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    And FCA will get what that asked for when these steering issues catch up to them. The NHTSA is likely keeping a very close eye on this due to the large number of complaints. Imagine a huge Jeep recall about the time Bronco rolls into showrooms.
     
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  15. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    There have been reports that the Feds were investigating consumer complaints with JL steering.
     
  16. LouJC

    LouJC Active Member

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    And just what kind of engineers have they hired? You know Jeep using the live axle with the Saginaw style steering box is not exactly new technology, it only goes back to AT LEAST the 1984 XJ, as far as I know. Mind boggling. Our 22 year old ZJ with the same set up and mostly an original front end does not wander even with 30" LT tires. As much as I wanted a Gladiator, I may simply go with another WK Limited 5.7 Hemi. I still love driving my '07. No wander there!
    PS lowering the inflation pressure on LT tires is not smart. They need more psi than a P rated tire to carry the same load. There are tire charts floating round the net that tells you if you replace a P tire with an LT tire, based on the load capacity built into the specs, how much you have to increase psi to have the same capacity with LT tires. On the ZJ (30"x9.5-15 C rated) we had to go from 36 psi to about 42, same thing on the '17 JK (245/75-16 C rated). I wanted to use LT tires on my 07 Grand (245/70-17) but the only ones I can find are all E rated which I feel is excessively stiff for a vehicle this weight (approx 4700 lbs). C would be ideal but it doesn't exist in that size...so I still run P tires at the standard 33 psi.
     
  17. 68RT

    68RT Well-Known Member

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    I don't think that they had any idea that the tires would fail the way they dud. Sales loved the look of the tire, accounting liked the cost factor and since it really was a truck based vehicle that needed a better ride than the solid axle would give them, sales asked for and got the lower psi. it all added up to an accident waiting to happen. They had never before experienced multiple tire failures on a "car" like vehicle. Mostly happened when or after heavy loads were hauled. If front failed, it seldom flipped. Rear had a big tendency to flip if on a curve. I remember rear tires failing for me in the past. It steers you while up front you can compensate. Ford got away with it and Firestone got stuck. However, they knew that Ford was running too low on psi and did not stop selling them. I doubt you will ever find a psi rating below mfgr specs ever again.
     
  18. unverferth

    unverferth Well-Known Member

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    Let's see. Jeep has been making solid axle 4wd vehicles since WWII. Now in 2020 there is a mystery to making them ? Where's Mr. Sheaves when we need him ?
     
  19. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    Just went on Jeep.com and found that ALL Gladiators, with the exception of Rubicon and Mojave, on “Employee Pricing.”

    Prices on Sports, Altitudes and Overlands have been slashed between $3,000 and $3,500 at the factory, before any dealer discounts.

    Wranglers by contrast, don’t show Employee Pricing. These new prices essentially put Wrangler and Gladiator at price parity.
     
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  20. HotCarNut

    HotCarNut Defender of Reality
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    Still....with the steering issues and everything else...I wonder if AEV has a good high-steer kit yet for JL? Maybe with that and upgraded suspension/tires....

    Geez, just realized I'm thinking about spending another $25k to fix a $50k+ vehicle from the factory. o_O
     
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