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WTF is going on at FCA?

Discussion in 'Mopar / FCA News' started by aldo90731, Jul 20, 2020.

  1. WXman

    WXman Active Member

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    If you read the TSB, it mentions that the software needs to be updated for the electronic steering. THIS is what I've been trying to tell guys for two full years now. My JL was HORRIBLE and after they totally reinstalled and updated the vehicle calibrations in the software, INSTANTLY it went to normal. Drove great after that. NO hard parts replaced. This was Jeep's first go at electronically controlling a solid axle steering system. It had some early bugs. Nobody gave it a chance and started throwing hard parts at it instead! Bad move!
     
    HotCarNut likes this.
  2. valiant67

    valiant67 ...

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    But the problem is there were mechanical issues too, like frame flex and steering boxes that appear to be built with too much internal slop.
    The whole incident reeks of inexperience, probably brought on by decades of letting quality talent leave the company.
     
  3. Dave Z

    Dave Z It's me, Dave
    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    Well, that was Sergio's policy: absolutely refuse to bring most of the old engineers back, and rely on brand new grads.
     
  4. jerseyjoe

    jerseyjoe Plymouth Makes It

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    This thread does not give me warm fuzzies about FCA products. Anyhow neighbor just had his year old Cadillac loaded on a flatbed today. Hope warrenty covers towing. This reinforces my idea of purchasing a 2000 Jeep GC. Would like to buy a loaded silver or white one that spent a leasurly life in Florida. I am sure there is one tucked in a garage some where.
     
    aldo90731 likes this.
  5. Jerry Simcik

    Jerry Simcik Well-Known Member

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    You guys are so naive. Insufficient caster IS THE ISSUE, not the steering box...
     
  6. Jerry Simcik

    Jerry Simcik Well-Known Member

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    "Dead spot on center" won't be affected by caster.

    The L-cars are over 9 degrees. I'd add 1-2 degrees to start and go from there...
     
  7. valiant67

    valiant67 ...

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    Please contact FCA and explain to them why their TSB is incorrect and they should just be adding more caster.
     
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  8. 68RT

    68RT Well-Known Member

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    There are potentially other things that come into the picture that I have not seen addressed. Where is the intersection of the pivot line in relation to tire centerline (rim offset) which is also changed with tire diameter. That can change the effect given by the amount of caster. It is seldom considered in an alignment but it does make a difference and that is something often changed by Jeep owners.
     
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  9. Zagnut27

    Zagnut27 Jeepaholic

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    And once again, for those in the back, it should not be up to the CUSTOMER to adjust the caster or steering box or whatever other “fixes” have popped up out there on countless YouTube videos. It’s a BRAND NEW vehicle from the factory that is having steering issues that to date the manufacturer has been unwilling or unable to fix. It is up to the MANUFACTURER to fix the issue, not the CUSTOMER to go fiddling around with something that should have been designed and manufactured correctly in the first place. Screwing around with the steering and suspension of your BRAND NEW vehicle is a good way to void your warranty, and could be dangerous especially if you don’t know what you’re doing.
     
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  10. page2171

    page2171 Well-Known Member

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    You need to slow down and read my post. I didn't say it is the steering box, the software, or even as you insist, the alignment. I'm saying that if it is the alignment, that either FCA's engineers are incompetent or FCA doesn't care, because it has been nearly three years and it isn't fixed yet.
     
    UN4GTBL, tlc, Zagnut27 and 2 others like this.
  11. hmk123

    Level III Supporter

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    That seems anything but smart. Would be nice if Mike reversed some of that...
     
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  12. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    Yes, it is covered under warranty.

    The sight a year ago of my 4-month-old Fiat being loaded onto a flatbed and taken away due to a second water pump failure in one week is still burnt on my retinas.
    [​IMG]

    Thankfully, that was the end of it. Haven't had any more issues since. Knock on wood!
     
  13. The Batman

    The Batman Active Member

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    Well, tooo beee faaaiiiirrr, you *did* buy a Fiat.
     
    aldo90731 likes this.
  14. Adventurer55

    Adventurer55 Well-Known Member

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    How can you say that on each of the vehicles that have been affected that there is no chance there is play in the steering box? Have you personally examined each one? Something more is wrong here, it's not all alignment issues.
     
    tlc likes this.
  15. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    Ehem...a Japan-built Fiat...

    Being built by Mazda in Japan played a key part in helping me take a chance on a Fiat. Tellingly, the parts on the car that have given me issue were made.by...Fiat.

    When everything is said and done, I am very happy with my choice; Spider is a great little car. Fiat brings the elements that make Spider stand out (sexy styling, spunky motor, a refined balance between handling and comfort, exhaust sound); Mazda brings the elements that make it last.
     
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  16. codypet

    codypet Well-Known Member

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    I have a padded Voyager dashboard that's almost 40 years old that would like a word with you. The hard plastic is the only part of the interior failing.
     
    CherokeeVision likes this.
  17. The Batman

    The Batman Active Member

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    I, too, remember when Chrysler used to make good cars. Look at my signature.
     
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  18. Adventurer55

    Adventurer55 Well-Known Member

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    The funny thing about the auto business in the last 20 or so years is supplier consolidation. You now have the same suppliers supplying the same type parts to many different auto manufacturers. So, with that said why are we always talking about chassis type parts on FCA products that appear to wear out before other manufacturers vehicles? Why is that when chances are it comes out of the same supplier plant? Really only two reasons I can think of. Bad design, or cheaply made. Any other reasons I didn't list?
     
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  19. aldo90731

    Staff Member Level III Supporter

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    That is a sweeping indictment of Grand Cherokee that is not justified IMO. Grand Cherokee remains one of the best selling SUVs on the market and has a global appeal.

    Grand Cherokee has probably received more investment than any other FCA vehicle during its cycle, to the point that there are hardly any Mercedes parts left in it. And keeping GC relevant for 10+ years is not easy.

    Besides, although FCA quality is nothing to brag about, Mercedes-Benz's measured quality has fallen significantly from its former glory.
     
    UN4GTBL, HotCarNut, Morty and 7 others like this.
  20. Jerry Simcik

    Jerry Simcik Well-Known Member

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    When you call FCA, you're not dealing with an engineer. You're dealing with a customer service rep who might have access to published data and specs. Their ability to diagnose and trouble-shoot issues is limited. They rely on dealers and maybe, if you're lucky, some sort of higher-level corporate technician. Most alignment techs simply look at the computer screen and try to make all the little boxes green; that's it anymore. And the way dealers get paid/reimbursed by FCA means that they are NOT going to invest time in these sorts of issues because they will lose money on them.

    FCA doesn't have the time nor resources to send an engineer out to the Jeeps this happens, document the modifications made, tear-down and examine every component, etc. It's not that they don't care, it's that they simply don't have the ability to do anything to help ONLY you...

    The dealer isn't going to spend hours and hours tying up a bay and a tech trying to find things when they KNOW they aren't going to be paid for that work.

    You're going to have to take control of the situation, learn everything you can about it, and then get it fixed...

    But you sound like you've given up... You seem like you don't want to try something new to fix it, you just want FCA to "do something about it"; whatever that means to you at this point... If that's your attitude, you're only going to grow more and more upset.
     
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