[TL Hanson]

Howdy fellow gearheads
I hate electronically controlled vehicles to begin with, that said, my 92 Van, sat for a lengthy period, now and whipping it back into shape. It needed new fuel pump mod in tank and tank cleaned, done, then powered pump direct and in line filter under pass side blew the supply line connection, Fram took 3 weeks but got it to me thru Summit Racing, Main computer was also replaced, And scanner and check engine light self diagnostics BOTH confirm fault in overdrive solenoid circuit. ironically Engine is V-6 with a 31RH (A998) so the manual does not provide ANY information.
So the big question now is will the bad OD Solenoid Circuit cause the computer to keep the ASD shutdown?? Positive suggestions always welcome, rude ones will be countered.

 

[Bob Lincoln]

"will the bad OD Solenoid Circuit cause the computer to keep the ASD shutdown??"

Not sure what to make of this comment. The two are unrelated.

 

[AllanC]

. . . .So the big question now is will the bad OD Solenoid Circuit cause the computer to keep the ASD shutdown?? . . .

The PCM (powertrain control module) directly controls the overdrive solenoid circuit. The PCM may have intelligent logic to disable the circuit if it senses a short to ground. Here is an easy test to perform to eliminate the OD solenoid circuit as the cause for no-start. Go under the vehicle on the driver side and view the side of the transmission. You will find 2 electrical connectors of 3 wires each. The connector that plugs vertically into the transmission is the overdrive control. Remove it from its socket. See if the engine will start. I am thinking that your issue will lie elsewhere.

Hopefully the vehicle is in a quiet area. Turn the ignition key switch to the ON / RUN position but not START. Do you hear the electric fuel pump power up for 1 - 2 seconds and then stop? IF YES then turn the ignition key to START and engage the starter for about 5 seconds. Release the ignition key switch to the ON / RUN position but do not turn to OFF. Do you hear the fuel pump continue to run for 1 - 2 seconds and then stop?
If you hear the fuel pump run for 1 - 2 seconds and then stop you know the crankshaft position sensor is functioning and sending a valid signal to the PCM to energize the ASD relay and fuel pump relay. If you do NOT hear the fuel pump run then either there is a wiring problem, fuse problem or crankshaft position sensor is not functioning properly and needs to be investigated.

 

[RalphP]

Howdy fellow gearheads
I hate electronically controlled vehicles to begin with, that said, my 92 Van, sat for a lengthy period, now and whipping it back into shape. It needed new fuel pump mod in tank and tank cleaned, done, then powered pump direct and in line filter under pass side blew the supply line connection, Fram took 3 weeks but got it to me thru Summit Racing, Main computer was also replaced, And scanner and check engine light self diagnostics BOTH confirm fault in overdrive solenoid circuit. ironically Engine is V-6 with a 31RH (A998) so the manual does not provide ANY information.
So the big question now is will the bad OD Solenoid Circuit cause the computer to keep the ASD shutdown?? Positive suggestions always welcome, rude ones will be countered.

What code is it returning?

There is one multi use code that sometimes turns up "OD Solenoid Circuit" errors, but isn't on your van (or my 1988 Dakota with the 31RH!) due to, well, no overdrive.

It may be better to double check the code against a proper manual.

RwP

 

[TL Hanson]

What code is it returning?

There is one multi use code that sometimes turns up "OD Solenoid Circuit" errors, but isn't on your van (or my 1988 Dakota with the 31RH!) due to, well, no overdrive.

It may be better to double check the code against a proper manual.

RwP

TY Ralph
The scanner itself reads out that its the OD solenoid circuit. ( I got a smart one ) but the Key test I believe was 45 code which verified the scanner. Since I had preplanned, and bought the new solenoid, going to unplug the old one and plug in new, even tho outside of trans, tomorrow. Thanks for offering a decent idea.

 

[Bob Lincoln]

Should not be a code 45 on this vehicle

Code 45 Turbo engines boost above predefined range
:

 

[TL Hanson]

The PCM (powertrain control module) directly controls the overdrive solenoid circuit. The PCM may have intelligent logic to disable the circuit if it senses a short to ground. Here is an easy test to perform to eliminate the OD solenoid circuit as the cause for no-start. Go under the vehicle on the driver side and view the side of the transmission. You will find 2 electrical connectors of 3 wires each. The connector that plugs vertically into the transmission is the overdrive control. Remove it from its socket. See if the engine will start. I am thinking that your issue will lie elsewhere.

Hopefully the vehicle is in a quiet area. Turn the ignition key switch to the ON / RUN position but not START. Do you hear the electric fuel pump power up for 1 - 2 seconds and then stop? IF YES then turn the ignition key to START and engage the starter for about 5 seconds. Release the ignition key switch to the ON / RUN position but do not turn to OFF. Do you hear the fuel pump continue to run for 1 - 2 seconds and then stop?
If you hear the fuel pump run for 1 - 2 seconds and then stop you know the crankshaft position sensor is functioning and sending a valid signal to the PCM to energize the ASD relay and fuel pump relay. If you do NOT hear the fuel pump run then either there is a wiring problem, fuse problem or crankshaft position sensor is not functioning properly and needs to be investigated.

TY Allan, totally aware of location, as I had to visually check I did have that connector on the back left side of trans. Whats funny is Manual says the engine/trans combo I have, I shouldnt have, 32RH was supposed to be the 92 Vans w/V6's ?? Thus the V6 I have doesnt have the crank sensor. And according to the manual wiring diagrams, ground is provided to the OD Solenoid from the Fuel Pump relay "coil" Pin 85 I think it was, ( trying to recall from memory at the moment) maybe pin 86, but one of those 2 anyway. and my DVM said all was fine when I did a continuity check for ground, I had ground on one and the other was open?? And after fuel filter was replaced, manually applied 12vdc to pump at the relay plug to check installation of the filter, pump humm'd and no gas leak detected.
As your suggestion has gotten me thinking a bit, may disconnect fuel supply at fuel rail to TBI, and see if fuel is getting thru the line to it. And since I had preplanned, and bought the new solenoid, going to unplug the old one and plug in new, even tho outside of trans, tomorrow. After those 2 things I will be out of suggestions and or ideas.
Hey but thanks Allan.

 

[TL Hanson]

Should not be a code 45 on this vehicle

Code 45 Turbo engines boost above predefined range
:

Thats what the stupid manual says, but am wondering Bob, because the 92 manaual for the Vans, says I should have a 32RH trans w/V6 not a 31RH( A998). Verified Trans type with label under the hood and p# on Trans, behind the serial number. Swapped out he coil also as there was no 12v to it. have not rechecked since installed.

 

[TL Hanson]

Thats what the stupid manual says, but am wondering Bob, because the 92 manaual for the Vans, says I should have a 32RH trans w/V6 not a 31RH( A998). Verified Trans type with label under the hood and p# on Trans, behind the serial number. Swapped out he coil also as there was no 12v to it. have not rechecked since installed.

pg 14-35 Bob of the factory manual, is the list of codes and fault, 45 reads "Overdrive Solenoid Circuit" - As an open or shorted condition detected in the overdrive solenoid circuit. ( engine packages with 42RH or 46RH automatic transmissions). and in section 21, Transmissions, it lists 32RH/36RH/42RH/46RH. And once upon a time I had called Chrysler, back when it was still Chrysler, and Customer service verified my engine/trans combo, said it was probably left over from 91.?? does that help your diagnostic ideas any Rob. One more thing the scanner DID mention turbo boost but stated it only applied to diesel or gas engines with turbo's.
Keep the ideas coming, we WILL figure this out I am sure !!!!

 

[RalphP]

If it's a 31RH or a 32RH, it has no overdrive; that's the fourth gear.

So ... I bet it's a 4 speed with overdrive (the 42RH/44RH, not a 31RH or 32RH).

Do you have a OD button on your dash?

RwP

 

[TL Hanson]

If it's a 31RH or a 32RH, it has no overdrive; that's the fourth gear.

So ... I bet it's a 4 speed with overdrive (the 42RH/44RH, not a 31RH or 32RH).

Do you have a OD button on your dash?

RwP

No Ralph I dont, I verified it by part #, on right side of trans, that it truly is an A998 aka 31RH, and has a lockup torque convertor

 

[AllanC]

[QUOTE="TL Hanson, post: 1085110027, member: 104721" . . . ]Thats what the stupid manual says, but am wondering Bob, because the 92 manaual for the Vans, says I should have a 32RH trans w/V6 not a 31RH( A998). Verified Trans type with label under the hood and p# on Trans, behind the serial number. . . . [/QUOTE]

Let's verify exactly what vehicle you have. Look at the VIN at base of windshield where dash meets it. Reading left to right 8th position is engine specification. 3.9 V6 will have code X. 10th position of VIN is model year for vehicle. 1991 - code M; 1992 - code N.

1991 model year all V6 and V8 engines were throttle body injection. No crankshaft position sensor. 1992 model year all V6 and V8 engines had individual port injection and equipped with crankshaft position sensor.

Check VIN codes and let us know what you have.

Whether you have a 1991 or 1992 model, you can still perform the listening test for the electric fuel pump. Turn ignition key switch to ON / RUN and listen for fuel pump to power up. Engage starter for few seconds and then release ignition key switch. Does pump continue to run for 1 - 2 seconds and then stop.

 

[ImperialCrown]

If the transmission is a 3-speed automatic with the replacement PCM expecting and failing to see an OD circuit, then it sounds like you were given the wrong PCM. The PCM they gave you is for a 4-speed automatic.

 

[Bob Lincoln]

Yes, 31RH and 32RH are 3-speed automatics, and have no overdrive. All 3-speed automatics were direct drive (1:1) in 3rd gear.

 

[TL Hanson]

[QUOTE="TL Hanson, post: 1085110027, member: 104721" . . . ]Thats what the stupid manual says, but am wondering Bob, because the 92 manaual for the Vans, says I should have a 32RH trans w/V6 not a 31RH( A998). Verified Trans type with label under the hood and p# on Trans, behind the serial number. . . .

Let's verify exactly what vehicle you have. Look at the VIN at base of windshield where dash meets it. Reading left to right 8th position is engine specification. 3.9 V6 will have code X. 10th position of VIN is model year for vehicle. 1991 - code M; 1992 - code N.

1991 model year all V6 and V8 engines were throttle body injection. No crankshaft position sensor. 1992 model year all V6 and V8 engines had individual port injection and equipped with crankshaft position sensor.

Check VIN codes and let us know what you have.

Whether you have a 1991 or 1992 model, you can still perform the listening test for the electric fuel pump. Turn ignition key switch to ON / RUN and listen for fuel pump to power up. Engage starter for few seconds and then release ignition key switch. Does pump continue to run for 1 - 2 seconds and then stop.[/QUOTE]
Yes Engine code in VIN is "X" and Yr Code is "N" manufactured 5-92. yes on both sensor and fuel rails. And NO right now even with new relays, which were bench checked prior to install, installed, since they are sold in pairs premounted, no actuation of the pump, unless I direct pin 12v from Batt to pin 30 on the plug then pump runs.

 

[RalphP]

No Ralph I dont, I verified it by part #, on right side of trans, that it truly is an A998 aka 31RH, and has a lockup torque convertor

Then you don't have a OD solenoid; and the PCM is confused. As is your scanner.

RwP

 

[TL Hanson]

Then you don't have a OD solenoid; and the PCM is confused. As is your scanner.

RwP

Ya know Ralph, I had that idea also, visually verified, that THERE IS an OD Solenoid. But it is NOT a 3pin as suggested by the wiring diagrams, its a 2 pin plug, which coincidentally what I got when I bought a new one about 2 yrs ago. But the ID label under the hood declares the Van has a lock up torque convertor??? Heavy Rains today kept me from going to work on this and crawl under it. And tomorrow is a 70% day so I may get to work on it sometime before Friday >crossing fingers.

 

[RalphP]

Ya know Ralph, I had that idea also, visually verified, that THERE IS an OD Solenoid. But it is NOT a 3pin as suggested by the wiring diagrams, its a 2 pin plug, which coincidentally what I got when I bought a new one about 2 yrs ago. But the ID label under the hood declares the Van has a lock up torque convertor??? Heavy Rains today kept me from going to work on this and crawl under it. And tomorrow is a 70% day so I may get to work on it sometime before Friday >crossing fingers.

Overdrive is NOT lockup!

The lockup torque converter 3 speed is a 2 pin connector, which my 1988 has.

When you have overdrive, it's a 3 pin connector (OD, LU, and common).

Don't confuse the two items. You can have overdrive and no lockup (don't believe me, check out a 1950's Studebaker). You can have lockup and no overdrive (the 3xRH transmissions). You can have neither (the 727 for instance.) Or you can have both.

If your transmission is 2 pin, it's 3 speed, no overdrive, no OD solenoid.

Again, that 45 code is something besides OD solenoid.

To hit one of my favorite sites for looking up OBD codes, Dakota Trouble Codes (at http://www.dakota-truck.net/CODES/codes.html )

1. Governor pressure solenoid circuit. **
2. Overdrive solenoid circuit. **
3. Governer mid-pressure malfunction. **
4. Governor pressure sensor volts above rated volts. **
5. Governor pressure sensor volts below rated volts. **
6. Transmission relay circuit. **
7. 3-4 shift malfunction. **
8. Governor low pressure malfunction. **
9. Governor pressure sensor. **
10. Overdrive switch low. **

** means MIL will be lit if this code is set.

I'd drop the OD codes, and check the others.

RwP

 

[Bob Lincoln]

Exactly. Thanks. He may have a lockup torque converter, but from what he's telling us, he has no overdrive. It's a 3-speed transmission.

And Ralph is correct, automatics with both OD and lockup have a 3-position plug. The center conductor is 12 volts, and the outer ones are the ground for each function.

 

[TL Hanson]

Overdrive is NOT lockup!

The lockup torque converter 3 speed is a 2 pin connector, which my 1988 has.

When you have overdrive, it's a 3 pin connector (OD, LU, and common).

Don't confuse the two items. You can have overdrive and no lockup (don't believe me, check out a 1950's Studebaker). You can have lockup and no overdrive (the 3xRH transmissions). You can have neither (the 727 for instance.) Or you can have both.

If your transmission is 2 pin, it's 3 speed, no overdrive, no OD solenoid.

Again, that 45 code is something besides OD solenoid.

To hit one of my favorite sites for looking up OBD codes, Dakota Trouble Codes (at http://www.dakota-truck.net/CODES/codes.html )

1. Governor pressure solenoid circuit. **
2. Overdrive solenoid circuit. **
3. Governer mid-pressure malfunction. **
4. Governor pressure sensor volts above rated volts. **
5. Governor pressure sensor volts below rated volts. **
6. Transmission relay circuit. **
7. 3-4 shift malfunction. **
8. Governor low pressure malfunction. **
9. Governor pressure sensor. **
10. Overdrive switch low. **

** means MIL will be lit if this code is set.

I'd drop the OD codes, and check the others.

RwP

Your working to hard Ralph LOL. But you ARE being a great help and I appreciate it immensely. Last 3 days here in GAWJA been very wet and preventing me from crawling under this unit to examine intensively. Even warming up the ole Digital to snap a few pix so we know we are on same page.
The scanner I got is one that doesnt "code", it gives you plain English readout. But the Flash Code on dash reads, 12, 45, 55 and according to Manual 45 is OD solenoid circuit open or shorted just like the scanner says.
Now to the Manual Section on Transmissions, the 32RH, the OD Solenoid is at the back left hand side and is a 3 pin connector, YET the wiring diagrams show an alternative for the 31 RH as a 2 pin. Am hoping today to get under the Van to verify everything. Rain quit this morning and just waiting for pavement under the van to dry to get under under it. Right now am pondering removing the Trans as it needs seal work etc and could have it functionally inspected afterwords. I'll patch more into this later, including a few pix.