[Fifth87]

I have the opportunity to re-enter the ranks of Dodge owners with the possible acquisition of my late father in law's Caliber.
As the title says, the sunroof leaks and is staining the headliner at the A Pillar on both sides as well as the seats.
He tried to have the selling dealer address the issue under warranty but their "Water Leak specialist" was unable to locate it.
I washed the car by hand yesterday, and I verified that it still leaks. When I contacted the dealer this AM to make another appointment to have it looked at again, I was informed the 3/36 warranty has expired. I made the appointment anyhow and intend to be a bit more vocal than my father in law was about the issue.
I know there is a TSB in regards to water stains on the headliner, not to mention that this is not an uncommon issue.
My mother in law doesn't drive, and the family was just going to allow the bank to take the car.
I am very interested in buying the car, but if this issue cannot be remedied, I don't want to deal with it.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[chuzz]

Odds are that the drains for the sunroof are clogged or kinked. That is not an uncommon problem on the Calibers and shame on the dealership for not correcting it. I'll PM you a website that is Caliber exclusive that you can visit and someone there will tell you what you need to do.

 

[ImperialCrown]

How many times did the dealer try to fix the water leak?
Bring all of the documentation (repair orders) with you to the dealer for proof. Their work should be basically guaranteed for 1 year.
You can escalate this to the service manager, dealer principal or district service administrator if necessary.
The headliner will have to come down and you can ask for a replacement if the stains cannot be removed and if 'good will' or service warranty will cover this. It should, although I don't know all the circumstances surrounding this repeated leak concern.
Tree debris and sunroof glass adjustment are the biggest offenders here. Damaged/detached drain hoses are also possible.

 

[Fifth87]

Chuzz- PM Rec'd- thanks!
Imperial Crown- I believe once. At this point I do believe it has been more than a year. I cannot locate the documentation in regards to it, I am in the midst of sorting a paper nightmare left behind. It might turn up, though.
I do recall he was displeased with the end result, and the service experience as a whole. Unfortunately, the in-laws were just not aggressive about getting it fixed. It was damp to the point of mold growing on the glass. I am mad about it seeing as it was SO obvious and the dealer managed to get out of repairing it correctly. I got a rather defensive reply when I talked to the dealer this morning, pointing out that "Overflow is normal" I disagree.
They did park under a pine tree for a long time, I bet tree debris is correct. I eyeballed the glass adjustment this morning and it looked relatively flat, but I am sure that means nothing. How hard are those drain hoses to access aside from headliner removal?

 

[ImperialCrown]

Yikes. The windshield has to come out in order to remove the headliner (it won't fit out the narrow rear hatch opening and you can't fold the headliner). Pine needles can plug the drain hoses. You can first try to clear them with a gentle reverse-blast of compressed air through each of the 4 drains.
Maybe if you have to, you can drop the headliner panel down enough to access the front and rear (total of 4 hoses).

23 - Body/Interior/HEADLINER/Removal

REMOVAL

Labor Operations: Click to display a list of Labor Operations associated with this procedure

NOTE: In the event the headliner is damaged or creased during removal, it will need to be replaced with a new headliner.
1. Remove front windshield, (Refer to 23 - Body/Stationary Glass/WINDSHIELD - Removal)
2. Remove A-pillar trim,(Refer to 23 - Body/Interior/PANEL, A-Pillar Trim - Removal)
3. Disconnect A-pillar trim wire connector (2).
4. Remove sunvisors, [url="https://w05.dealerconnect.chrysler.com/service/mds2002/getSoftLink.do?NewSoftLinkId=2300370029637&VID=2980776780&TOCSRCNAME=NAS&YEAR=2009&MDSLOCALE=en_US"](Refer to 23 - Body/Interior/VISOR - Removal)
[/url] 5. Remove sun visor screws and retainers, (Refer to 23 - Body/Interior/MIRROR, Rearview - Installation)




6. Disconnect front washer hose (1).
7. Remove universal homelink module and connector, [url="https://w05.dealerconnect.chrysler.com/service/mds2002/getSoftLink.do?NewSoftLinkId=0800860000037&VID=2980776780&TOCSRCNAME=NAS&YEAR=2009&MDSLOCALE=en_US"](Refer to 08 - Electrical/8M - Message Systems/Universal Transmitter - Removal) .
[/url] 8. Remove and disconnect dome lamp,(Refer to 08 - Electrical/8L - Lamps and Lighting/Lamps/Lighting - Interior/LAMP, Dome - Removal)
9. Remove front and rear grab handles (3).
10. Remove seat belt turning loops.
11. Remove B-pillar upper trim, (Refer to 23 - Body/Interior/PANEL, B-Pillar Trim - Removal)
12. Remove B-pillar lower trim, (Refer to 23 - Body/Interior/PANEL, B-Pillar Trim - Removal)
13. Remove fastener attaching cargo loop to rear quarter trim.
14. Remove rear seat striker bezel.
15. Remove C-pillar trim, (Refer to 23 - Body/Interior/PANEL, C-Pillar Trim - Removal)
16. Remove rear quarter trim, (Refer to 23 - Body/Interior/PANEL, Quarter Trim - Removal)
17. Remove cargo load floor, (Refer to 23 - Body/Interior/COVER - Removal)
18. Remove liftgate scuff plate, (Refer to 23 - Body/Interior/PLATE, Scuff - Removal)
19. Remove rear cargo dome light and disconnect connector, (Refer to 08 - Electrical/8L - Lamps and Lighting/Lamps/Lighting - Interior/LAMP, Dome - Removal)
20. Remove rear headliner push pins.
21. Disconnect rear washer hose connector
22. Lower headliner.
23. With the help of an assistant, remove headliner through front windshield opening.

 

[rmoore0949]

known issue- open the sunroof and gently pour some water by the two front corners- if either corner flows slow, clear with some compressed air until flow is restored. Water stains the headliner because it will overflow in the trough and run down the front edges of the headliner. Overflow is not normal- some water getting past the glass is- the seal is not weathertight, just make sure the glass is adjusted. See this quite often on all Chryslers with sunroofs, esp caliber/compass/patriots. BTW, this is something I educate the customer on to check because of the fact that it happens so often- easy fix

 

[Fifth87]

Yikes is what I should be saying- that looks quite involved, especially the windshield removal part. Where do these drains exit so I can check the other ends?
-rmoore0949, I sure hope what you are saying is the cause in this case and not a disconnected drain tube. Your clarification of the water management makes more sense than what I was told.
I checked the troughs and saw no debris blocking the tubes. I'll check the flow when I have a chance. Approx how many psi should I use, I don't want to break anything!

 

[ImperialCrown]

A gentle breeze out of the end of a rubber-tipped air gun should be OK. If the drain hose is kinked or blocked, you don't want to blow it off of its end fitting where you can't easily get to it for reattachment.
Did you get my service procedure email?
Frt drains exit down the A-pillar behind the front fender splash shield area. Rear drains exit down the C-pillar to in front of the rear wheels.
Maybe the headliner stain can be rectified without replacement. The headliner may have to be dropped down for sunroof service.

 

[rmoore0949]

only time Ive seen a disconnected tube is due to someone using excessive pressure to blow it clear. You can remove the a-pillar trim and see up there though if thats the case

 

[Fifth87]

Ok- I'll try light air pressure- I certainly don't want to make it worse!
Imperial Crown- Yes, I rec'd your email and replied to it. Thanks again.
With the pending hurricane, I don't have time to troubleshoot it unfortunately.

 

[Fifth87]

Ok, had my appt with the dealer last Monday. They found that the drain tubes were clogged running down the A-pillars as suspected by me and also noted that the sunroof seal "shows some wear".
Car sat all thru the week with the storm happening. Checked the headliner after the storm and it was dry. Nice!

Went to vacuum the car today and removed the floor mats. I noted the passenger side floor is wet, no standing water, but wet. In the past the car had been to the dealer to "reseal the front end'.
I am not sure if this is related to the sunroof still, such as that seal still requires replacement, or water intrusion from the cowl/firewall, or more distantly, a clogged AC condensate tube, since I have been using the defroster quite a bit.

Any ideas??

 

[peterjon1]

It wouldn't surprise me if the A/C drain was plugged with debris, as the sunroof drains were. You can carefuly poke a wire up through the A/C drain from the engine compartment to maybe free it up. Just don't be too aggressive and damage the evaporator. I'd use a fairly stiff wire with a small hook bent into the end to help catch any debris and pull it out.
Also, check that the cowl drains are clear. Those pine needles can plug things up good.

 

[Fifth87]

Ok, I will try the drain first. Couldn't see it when I looked this afternoon, perhaps I have to get under the car? I noticed a heat shield that covered them and the firewall from the exhaust system.
I know if I open the hood and look down the hinges I can see pine needles , so I had suspected the cowl drains as well. I have no idea how to access them to clean them however. It looks like removing the wiper arms and cowl screen as well.
I knew being parked under that tree was going to come back to haunt me. I hate pine needles!

 

[ImperialCrown]

Tree debris is the worst offender when it comes to plugged cowl, sunroof, A/C evaporator and rocker water drains. Sap can also damage paint and has to be scraped from glass with a fresh single edge razor blade and solvent.
Wiper arms have to come off to get the cowl screen off. It isn't that difficult. Just pop the arm pivot cap, remove the nut, raise the arms to a standing position and gently wiggle the arm off. Left and right side arms are different.
You may want to pull the carpet and padding away from the passenger side firewall to help it dry before it gets stinky and to try and find the water leak source. Probably cowl or A/C drain for passenger foot well water.
A factory 2009 Caliber service repair manual would be helpful here. Sometimes a picture of how something comes apart is priceless. Definite Xmas wish list material. I see them for cheap on ebay, but I can't vouch for their content.