AN: Jeep recall: unintended consequences
Chrysler has issued two recalls and one customer care action in response to government requests. 1993-98 Grand Cherokees and 2002-07 Libertys are getting a voluntary recall; those with Mopar or factory hitches will get a checkup and, if needed, a free upgrade. Those with no hitch or an aftermarket hitch will get a free trailer hitch. A similar “customer care action” is being taken on 1999-2004 Grand Cherokees: those with aftermarket hitches will get an inspection and, if needed, an upgrade. Those with factory hitches or no hitches will not get an inspection or upgrade or free hitch. News analysis The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) has pressured Chrysler into voluntarily recalling huge numbers of old Jeep Grand Cherokees and Jeep Libertys. The “repair,” adding a hitch or replacing an aftermarket hitch, might or might not have an effect; the Jeeps already perform to tougher fuel-leakage standards, according to..
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Nice analysis, Dave!
1974 Plymouth Valiant - 2013 Dodge Dart - 2013 Chrysler 300C
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I want to know what this is really going to equate to. First it was a $300million fix (I think that was the number), now it is a trailer hitch? Some have them, some don't, upgrades to existing ones on some, replacement of some on others? Add some to even others? What percentage of Jeeps started with trailer hitches to start with, and is it going to be a smaller number afterwards to make it less than the $300M pricetag, or is it going to be a CBO estimate that actually triples or quadruples before it is all said and done?
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How much will the Jeep recall cost? Well, if you are in the Jeep and it gets rear-ended and you die, what do you think that's worth? I can tell you what my wife thinks it is worth alright. Anyway, the cost really doesn't matter. The auto industry is sitting on over $10 billion dollars in warranty reserves so they might as well spend a little of it. After all, they got that from us folks out here who are buying them. Oh, and here's another Jeep Liberty recall - this one's a baby stroller - really! The tires rupture and the wheel goes flying into parts -
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HemiDayton, welcome to the forum. Yes, they got that insurance money out of us, sure, but how much more will we be charged since the insurance company has to charge Chrysler more because they used it? It doesn't matter what each and every one of us are worth, we take the chance of having one guarantee in life every time we breathe, a chance we take in getting into any car, bus, van, or on a bike, skateboard or sidewalk, sometimes the guarantee is is out of your control so we take the chance based on probability and rarity of it happening. The things was, the Jeeps were no more dangerous than many other vehicles out there, so why did Jeep have to spend their insurance money over every other company with equal or greater, or less for that matter, chances of catching fire when getting rear ended? Insurance should not have to be used because someone forces you to do it with their opinion it should be done and not without physical evidence it is a safety hazard to others, which the NHTSA even said they had no proof of the dangers.
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I think that 51 deaths over x amount of years is nothing like the death toll of Toyota and their accelerator/brake defect. Even at that the Deaths were all in US and possibly mexico and Canada, where Toyota was responsible for over a hundred deaths since '04 in the US and an undisclosed amount over seas in places like Japan and Sadi Arabia. In fact on my local PBR station I am continually hearing about Toyota/Lexus/Scion problems even after the recall, but until a few weeks ago I never heard anything about Jeeps being faulty. I believe that some of this bad press is being fueled by Chrysler's competitors, since they fear Chryslers steady comeback.
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I have to respectfully disagree with the sweeping generalization "federal agencies out of control". This issue was started by private individuals who got the backing of an advocacy group who pressured the government to do something. IMHO, in this case, the worst thing we can accuse the government of doing is trying to please (or be the mediator of) both sides, which means no solution for either side. Not effective... maybe. Out of control... not this time. The unintended consequences are the really sad part of this whole mess...
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If you are in any vehicle and get rear ended or t-boned or whatever bad enough... theres a chance you could die... in any vehicle. There is no guarantee or promise of safety in any vehicle out on the roads...that is the risk we all take by hopping in a vehicle. The best we can do is mitigate the risks by safety features, and in order to make it a level playing field, have a set of standards for those features. However, when the proverbial sh*t hits the fan and a bad traffic accident happens, eapecially something as catastrophic as a semi rear ending a passenger vehicle at high speed, there is only so much those safety features/standards can do. Do you blame the results of the accident on the features of the vehicle that were never designed to handle that degree of an accident? Or is it just part of the inherent risk in life---you cant plan or protect for every eventuality. If a man is wearing a bulletproof vest, and then gets shot in the leg, do you go after the manufacturer of the bulletproof vest and say their product is defective for not stopping the bullet? No---because that is an unreasonable expectation, just as a vehicle that meets all the safety standards for the time it was built, cant reasonably be expected to handle something that probably any other vehicle in the same situation wouldnt be able to handle. You didnt buy a tank, or an armored car, you bought a jeep, a passenger vehicle. Put any vehicle of that vintage up against a semi, and it'll lose every time, same way as the jeep does. Not the manufacturers fault...just the outcome of the circumstances. NHTSA needs to just grow a pair and tell these lobbying groups the truth...that sh*t happens, and to quit trying to pin it on vehicle manufacturers, just for the sake of having a scapegoat.HemiDayton said:
I just dont understand why it is just these vehicles that are mentioned. Id love to see an explorer or other vehicle of the same year put in the same scenario and see how it fairs...and then shove that video down NHTSA and the media's throat.
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For whatever reason, sometimes I see lots of replies to this topic (mostly pro-Chrysler/anti-government); more recently only four of them.
The recall situation doesn't really affect my opinion of Chrysler very much or the Grand Cherokee. I've always been concerened about the gas tank location on these vehicles, the "regular" 1984- Cherokee, and Patriot. (Also the first-gen Chevrolet S-10 Blazer et al. and the Ford Bronco/Bronco II.) The tanks stick down below the bumpers on all these, and the higher stance of SUVs puts the tank straight in line with the bumpers of standard sedans. I think if an Oldsmobile Ninety Eight like mine (1990's body) rear-ended a GC, the Olds bumper would bash the tank just as the Jeep's bumper bashed the Oldsmobile's grille. And with all those boneheads texting while driving that can't even see a school bus right in front of them...
Meanwhile, the older Wrangler's tank is in a similar position but looks like it's surrounded by a cast-steel shield. My late mother's 1967 Chrysler has a tank mere inches from the bumper (like most vehicles of its era). But I don't think I could lift that bumper by myself (either that or it'd give me a hernia) and it shields the tank well. Somehow I imagine a typical rear impact involving that old Newport would involve a lurch and a crunch, a case of whiplash for the passengers (no head restraints) and the new owner p****d about having a devil of a time replacing his dented bumper and trunk lid. And behind the Chrysler would be a Hyundai or Focus etc. with a squashed front end.
The GCs and Libertys were built long after the Pinto was made infamous. Could/should the engineers have made the Jeeps safer? I think so. Does that make Chrysler a terrible company? Absolutely not. All the manufactuers have made big bungles with harmful consequences. I think Beentherebefore is pretty much on target regarding a fight with NHTSA. And the public somehow has an anti-Mopar bias so this could be worse for the company than the accelerating cars were for Toyota. Chrysler Group raises some good points too, however. Like so many controversies where people tend to take sides, the truth is in the middle somewhere.
The recall situation doesn't really affect my opinion of Chrysler very much or the Grand Cherokee. I've always been concerened about the gas tank location on these vehicles, the "regular" 1984- Cherokee, and Patriot. (Also the first-gen Chevrolet S-10 Blazer et al. and the Ford Bronco/Bronco II.) The tanks stick down below the bumpers on all these, and the higher stance of SUVs puts the tank straight in line with the bumpers of standard sedans. I think if an Oldsmobile Ninety Eight like mine (1990's body) rear-ended a GC, the Olds bumper would bash the tank just as the Jeep's bumper bashed the Oldsmobile's grille. And with all those boneheads texting while driving that can't even see a school bus right in front of them...
Meanwhile, the older Wrangler's tank is in a similar position but looks like it's surrounded by a cast-steel shield. My late mother's 1967 Chrysler has a tank mere inches from the bumper (like most vehicles of its era). But I don't think I could lift that bumper by myself (either that or it'd give me a hernia) and it shields the tank well. Somehow I imagine a typical rear impact involving that old Newport would involve a lurch and a crunch, a case of whiplash for the passengers (no head restraints) and the new owner p****d about having a devil of a time replacing his dented bumper and trunk lid. And behind the Chrysler would be a Hyundai or Focus etc. with a squashed front end.
The GCs and Libertys were built long after the Pinto was made infamous. Could/should the engineers have made the Jeeps safer? I think so. Does that make Chrysler a terrible company? Absolutely not. All the manufactuers have made big bungles with harmful consequences. I think Beentherebefore is pretty much on target regarding a fight with NHTSA. And the public somehow has an anti-Mopar bias so this could be worse for the company than the accelerating cars were for Toyota. Chrysler Group raises some good points too, however. Like so many controversies where people tend to take sides, the truth is in the middle somewhere.
1966 Crown Coupe, 2016 200 S AWD, 1962 Lark Daytona V8.
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An off-road option added skid plates under the transfer case and fuel tank. The plate was mainly for brush/rock protection and not for a rear crash, but it may help in one. The trailer hitch offer is a good one. photo-11.jpg
The Patriot's fuel tank is safely ahead of the rear axle, what you are seeing under the rear bumper is the muffler. eSkidPlatesA.jpg
All these vehicles met the applicable safety standards at the time of manufacture.
Chrysler and the others stepped up in the early 2000's to add free child seat teather anchors and free child seat inspections in the interest of public safety. I was trained in the Chrysler/Fisher-Price 'Fit for a kid' program and got to meet with a lot of parents and kids.
It was good PR (even though I have a face that makes the kids cry-I gave out a little toy after I learned this to smooth things over).
Every recall can be a dealer/factory PR moment, even though the circumstances surrounding a recall are grim, it should be used for a win/win visit. Make the best of a bad situation, it's about helping folks feel better about what they drive.
The Patriot's fuel tank is safely ahead of the rear axle, what you are seeing under the rear bumper is the muffler. eSkidPlatesA.jpg
All these vehicles met the applicable safety standards at the time of manufacture.
Chrysler and the others stepped up in the early 2000's to add free child seat teather anchors and free child seat inspections in the interest of public safety. I was trained in the Chrysler/Fisher-Price 'Fit for a kid' program and got to meet with a lot of parents and kids.
It was good PR (even though I have a face that makes the kids cry-I gave out a little toy after I learned this to smooth things over).
Every recall can be a dealer/factory PR moment, even though the circumstances surrounding a recall are grim, it should be used for a win/win visit. Make the best of a bad situation, it's about helping folks feel better about what they drive.
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"An off-road option added skid plates under the transfer case and fuel tank. The plate was mainly for brush/rock protection and not for a rear crash, but it may help in one. "
The skid plate package, is in addition to the steel tub surrounding the fuel tank.
I've never seen a Liberty or Grand Cherokee without one. Perhaps 2WD models???
Of note, all of my full sized Cherokee/Wagoneers have mid section mounted tanks with steel enclosures., so it's interesting that Daimler went back to rear mounted tanks on Liberty and GC.
The skid plate package, is in addition to the steel tub surrounding the fuel tank.
I've never seen a Liberty or Grand Cherokee without one. Perhaps 2WD models???
Of note, all of my full sized Cherokee/Wagoneers have mid section mounted tanks with steel enclosures., so it's interesting that Daimler went back to rear mounted tanks on Liberty and GC.
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