[FreeLantz]

A few observations. I like to look at the sales numbers by platform to see the bigger picture.


Caravan is the best selling vehicle in Dodge's lineup (unless you count Ram) for June and second best for the year, only slightly behind Avenger. And yet they talk about killing it. Sales numbers for Caravan and T&C are almost identical for both the month and year-to-date, which totally blows away the theory that one is more popular or that having two minivans is somehow redundant. Then in the press release they mention repeatedly the Ram C/V having it's "best month ever" with a whopping 150 unit increase over last year. Priorities people, priorities! All together Chrysler sold 22,125 minivans last month, with virtually no advertising budget.

Jeep eeks out a small increase year-over-year and somehow manages to have it's best June since 2005....without Liberty/Cherokee. Most of this is due to Grand Cherokee but Wrangler helps, too. The Grand Cherokee and Durango both post big gains, and combine for 21,216 units. That may be an all-time record for the two.

200/Avenger combine for 19,942, rounding out the top three non-truck platforms. 300/Charger/Challenger were next at 19,193 combined.

Chrysler is at over 900,000 units for the year, and we're not to the halfway mark yet. This would indicate Chrysler is on track for a 2,000,000-plus year easily.

 

[UN4GTBL]

Good summary David.

If they are doing this now, with diesel light duty Rams coming, and if the Cherokee takes off (like they are hoping) and then we have the new 200 coming as well...should be a good future

They have to figure out the minivans and Dodge rumors tho.

 

[Dave Z]

Many Caravan sales are fleet, while T&C tends to be retail (and more profit). That's part of the msising data.

 

[UN4GTBL]

Many Caravan sales are fleet, while T&C tends to be retail (and more profit). That's part of the msising data.

I'd say a number of T&C Tourings are Fleet too, judging by rental lots.

 

[FreeLantz]

I'd say a number of T&C Tourings are Fleet too, judging by rental lots.

I've always found that to be true, too. In fact it seems to swing back and forth between Caravan and T&C, depending on when you look. Granted, the highest-margin minivans of all are the loaded T&C's. But I'm sure those account for a very small percentage, with most of the sales being bread-and-butter T&C Touring and Caravan SXT models.

 

[Mr.Source]

Well, the 300 keeps falling, no matter their "special" esditions, the car keeps falling like a rock. We already have the new transmission, so what's the problem?

 

[thejdj]

Well I did my part.

Purchased June 21.

 

[Dave Z]

300 is dropping because they dropped the entry level model, so they could get better lease residual and make the car more attractive and credible to high end buyers.

I applaud the decision to sacrifice sales for image and profitability.

I think most of those “lost” sales are going to Dodge and C200. I don't think they're all going to Hyundai and Toyota.

Gee, what a day, when a brand would voluntarily give up sales to a sister brand!

 

[Erik Latranyi]

Dart and 500 going backwards.

Gee, what a day, when a brand would voluntarily give up sales to a sister brand!

But the same people think it's not a good idea for minivans.

 

[abgwin]

I don't think that identical sales numbers of two models that share everything but cosmetics and options does not mean that they're not redundant. There's no current measure as to whether a consumer who bought a Caravan would balk at a Town & Country, or vice versa. Sales numbers alone don't tell you which model they came in to see, first looked at, or why they chose the one they did.

It also can not answer the most important question: if one model went away, would they head to a Toyota or Honda dealership instead?

 

[Mike V.]

300 is dropping because they dropped the entry level model, so they could get better lease residual and make the car more attractive and credible to high end buyers.

I applaud the decision to sacrifice sales for image and profitability.

I think most of those “lost” sales are going to Dodge and C200. I don't think they're all going to Hyundai and Toyota.

Gee, what a day, when a brand would voluntarily give up sales to a sister brand!

I agree! Well stated. I think this is a great representation of the 300's "problem".

Mike

 

[larryv]

Inventories FWIW
Models/days-Supply:
Fiat:
500/104
500L/92

Chrysler:
200/63
300/94
T&C/56

Jeep:
Compass/61
Patriot/57
Wrangler/46
Grand Cherokee/58

Dodge:
Dart/95
Avenger/61
Charger/41
Challenger/56
Journey/84
Caravan/50
Durango/78

Ram:
Pickup/96
CargoVan/28

 

[dakrt99]

Challenger is having a great year, it may get close to 55-60K for the year, wow. The Wrangler and Grand Cherokee continue to be a rock star. Ram truck seems to be a cash cow and just wait for the 2014 changes. Look at all the models that are up nearly double digits for YTD. The Journey is quietly kicking but without any help from Chrysler. 8 models with double digit YTD increases!

1500: up 22.9% YTD
Durango: up 32% YTD
Journey: up 15.5% YTD
Challenger: up 27.8% YTD
Charger: up 13.6% YTD
Avenger: up 15.4% YTD
Patriot: up 16.5% YTD
Compass: up 30.5% YTD

Impressive list. There are only 2, currently produced, models down for the year, not bad at all.

 

[UN4GTBL]

But the same people think it's not a good idea for minivans.

Well, they have tried, the lowest T&C model is no longer around.

With the Caravan gone, you then have to kill sales of the T&C by dropping the base model to keep the T&C's "status" and thus force customers to another company if they are budget constrained, or try and stuff them into a not-a-Caravan

IIRC, the sales of the T&C and Caravan have equalled since 2011 right? (When they reconfigured the trim levels)

The Caravan outsells the T&C lik 7 to 1 up here, but it's pretty even with the T&C in the states, where before the trim level change it was outselling the Caravan? Or am I remembering it wrong?

 

[Muther]

It also can not answer the most important question: if one model went away, would they head to a Toyota or Honda dealership instead?

It's all about price. If there is no minivan, with the options they want, at the price they want, then yes, they will bail. If this CUV can successfully be slotted in to replace the lower end minivans, then no, but, that is a huge if. I think that a minivan buyer is a minivan buyer 8 out of ten times. i don't think they will buy a minivan that is more than what they want to spend, and I don't think they will buy a cross over that is within their budget.

What do the sales types think?

 

[bumonbox]

Dart and 500 going backwards.



But the same people think it's not a good idea for minivans.

EXACTLY. OF COURSE the Caravan has higher fleet sales - because it's the entry level, meanwhile, the T&C tops out with more goodies more quickly. Great for T&C residual values AND they get to keep the gravy sales. It sounds pretty straightforward. no reason to kill it. Management seems confused sometimes.

 

[Muther]

Dart and 500 going backwards.

It is my personal opinion that the Dart is just too big. The compact people want it to be physically smaller, the midsize people want it to be bigger. Anyone that thinks that the 2.4 and the 9 speed are going to turn the Dart into a hit are thinking wrong (imo). Make it smaller, and lighter, and more inline with a true compact, and it will sell big time. Giving it a hatch would be nice.

 

[hmk123]

I think you raise a good point. After our Fiat 500 got totaled we had a Cadillac ATS as a rental. I was surprised to learn later that the Dart is pretty much almost the same size as the ATS. Cars like the Focus are usually bought by younger folks who prefer smaller cars. That said, we love our Dart. We got a great deal and it offers so much car for the money that I don't know what is holding people back... But then people that are older are probably looking at mid-sized cars like the Camry.

 

[Dave Z]

Chrysler has always had a problem fitting into niches

Good point regarding fleet sales of the vans.

If they drop Caravan, they will extend T&C downwards, count on it. Chrysler is not moving up, 300 is. They've latched onto the idea of a brand within a brand. Wrangler is the “seriously capable” Jeep, 300 is the “luxury” Chrysler, 500 is a whole Fiat line.

Don't be surprised if they end up with a Wrangler Classic, Wrangler Unlimited, Wrangler Scrambler pickup, and Wrangler XJ hardtop. (Yes, that's four bodies. The thing that leads me to think they won’t do all four, other than Mike Manley saying the main reason for Wrangler sales is the convertible function, is plant capacity. Now, if they adapted another plant to help out... or stopped building export Wranglers in the USA, since they will be made in China and India...)