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Jeepaholic
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Yeah, it’s not like JL had bad frame welds, noise/vibration from the hardtop, and steering issues that dragged on for years that also afflicted Gladiators. Oh…wait…they did. Oops.

If your house ain’t in order, its best to not throw stones at others.
 

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Yeah hardtops at the factory aren't doing too hot. I've heard they tape them up as soon as the assembly is done
 

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And the Gladiator has a rear window leak problem on hardtops too.
 
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And Ford is using that engine and tranny that are causing trouble in everything they put it in. Really sad to see they are doing that. So if it works like it usually does, they'll sell a bunch real quick and in no time the failures will start and expound and expound and once again where it looks like that had a monster seller on their hands will be beset by warranty costs, lawsuits et al and once again we'll all be shaking our heads at how they can screw up something that should be a no-brainer. I'll never understand the management of U.S. auto companies.
 

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And Ford is using that engine and tranny that are causing trouble in everything they put it in. Really sad to see they are doing that. So if it works like it usually does, they'll sell a bunch real quick and in no time the failures will start and expound and expound and once again where it looks like that had a monster seller on their hands will be beset by warranty costs, lawsuits et al and once again we'll all be shaking our heads at how they can screw up something that should be a no-brainer. I'll never understand the management of U.S. auto companies.
The same thing happens in automakers from all countries. Turns out running a car company is complex.
 

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Jeepaholic
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The same thing happens in automakers from all countries. Turns out running a car company is complex.
Yeah, who knew? lol
 

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And it can’t be that bad or none of the companies would be in business anymore. Of course, that doesn’t help the person who is experiencing problems…
 

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Jeepaholic
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A hardtop issue will not stop the vehicle, nor does it sound like a safety issue. It no doubt leaves owners unhappy, but at least they have their vehicle and can drive it, and it can be addressed and resolved as time goes on. The supplier issue needs to be fixed though, which has been a frequent explanation reported for Wrangler and Gladiator issues. It's hard to get good help these days apparently.

I'm not defending Ford for their issues. I just have to laugh because people here will make every excuse for issues that arise with Wranglers and Gladiators...always a "supplier issue", and giving a free pass to Jeep, but if it happens with another manufacturer, then its all pitchforks and torches for that company. Hypocrisy at it's finest.
 

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1966 Crown Coupe, 2016 200 S AWD, 1962 Lark Daytona V8.
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It is bad karma to gloat at a competitor's misfortune. Learning and repercussions can hurt no matter who you are.
Buyer remorse is very difficult to undo, once begun. Early production is being watched closely by QA.

The Blue Egg Guys and Gals will love their Broncos and Mavericks, just as the Ram-fans and Jeepers love their pride and joy. :)
 

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A hardtop issue will not stop the vehicle, nor does it sound like a safety issue. It no doubt leaves owners unhappy, but at least they have their vehicle and can drive it, and it can be addressed and resolved as time goes on. The supplier issue needs to be fixed though, which has been a frequent explanation reported for Wrangler and Gladiator issues. It's hard to get good help these days apparently.

I'm not defending Ford for their issues. I just have to laugh because people here will make every excuse for issues that arise with Wranglers and Gladiators...always a "supplier issue", and giving a free pass to Jeep, but if it happens with another manufacturer, then its all pitchforks and torches for that company. Hypocrisy at it's finest.
Ford struggled with the hardtop supplier from Day One. Many of the order delays are related to the hard top. Ford told customers that if they switch to a soft top, they will get their vehicles quicker. Ford offered credits for a hard top later down the road.

The manufacturer, Webasto, is German owned. Ford has sent engineers into the plant to get quality and production levels up. But Webasto is horribly mismanaged and has not made the situation easier.

I am sure Ford has looked for another supplier, but molding large pieces like this is not like a metal fabricator.

Ford is asking customers to report online any top issues. They are handing credits and replacements out as well. Ford is not waiting, denying or saying "they all do that".

But it does hurt the Bronco launch, like any other all-new vehicle.
 

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Ford struggled with the hardtop supplier from Day One. Many of the order delays are related to the hard top. Ford told customers that if they switch to a soft top, they will get their vehicles quicker. Ford offered credits for a hard top later down the road.

The manufacturer, Webasto, is German owned. Ford has sent engineers into the plant to get quality and production levels up. But Webasto is horribly mismanaged and has not made the situation easier.

I am sure Ford has looked for another supplier, but molding large pieces like this is not like a metal fabricator.

Ford is asking customers to report online any top issues. They are handing credits and replacements out as well. Ford is not waiting, denying or saying "they all do that".

But it does hurt the Bronco launch, like any other all-new vehicle.
You mean Ford isn’t going to tell buyers “it’s a Bronco thing” and deny anything is wrong for three years?
 

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If the real issue is with the molded in color
New car gets released, new car has problems.
Holy mackerel, this isn't a new thing people.
Yep, it's all about how the manufacturer addresses the issue and takes care of their customers.

That's the bottom line that can lead to brand loyalty.
 

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And Ford is using that engine and tranny that are causing trouble in everything they put it in. Really sad to see they are doing that. So if it works like it usually does, they'll sell a bunch real quick and in no time the failures will start and expound and expound and once again where it looks like that had a monster seller on their hands will be beset by warranty costs, lawsuits et al and once again we'll all be shaking our heads at how they can screw up something that should be a no-brainer. I'll never understand the management of U.S. auto companies.
Agreed. Ford bills itself as a company producing quality products, and does hold something of a reputation for doing so. The truth is, they've had quite a time lately building vehicles that will hold up. That is worthy of note. It is also not to say that other companies do not have issues, as that assumption is disingenuous, at best (to put it extremely kindly).

The reason I take such great exception to Ford's issues here on Allpar is not just because of the inconsistency of Ford's marketing, but because their plethora of manufacturing issues allow other OEM's to lower their standards (or justify their already lower standards) of quality. Stellantis could point their finger and say, "well, we have this Hemi that eats cams and lifters, but look at Ford ... "

I would like to see the Big 3 re-adapt the quality strategies they began to use in the early 80's to compete with the imports. Chrysler was probably the best example of that, and it was truly the best thing Lido ever did for the company. If we compared build quality from, say, 1978 or 1979, to that of 1981, it was a night and day difference. The engineering excellence was certainly always there, but parts quality and non-existent build quality were definitely factors in the near-demise of Chrysler Corporation. Those problems have since reappeared along the way at the Big 3, and it sure doesn't seem as though anyone at the top cares.

The quality lessons seem to have been lost by executives focused solely on profit margins and stock prices. What really disappoints is reading an article like this, and then reading about the OEM's planning to reduce output in order to keep prices sky-high. In fact, Ford is crowing about its quarterly returns, even while their newest vehicles are likely spending more time in the shop than ever. Little to nothing is said about massive investments in engineering improvements, parts quality, and build quality.

The disconnect is astonishing, and nobody here should be dismissing these types of articles because of a brand preference, whether whole or in part. This affects all consumers and enthusiasts alike.
 

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New car gets released, new car has problems.
Holy mackerel, this isn't a new thing people.
Problems should be worked out before releasing vehicle for mass production. Just because everyone else is cheaping out and deflecting the make-it-right cost onto consumers, doesn't make it ok.

No chance in hell I'm paying almost as much money as I did on my house for a new car or truck, and I'm expected to just accept issues that shouldn't be a thing after 100+ years of auto manufacturing, because engineers made a slightly different frame geometry than the decades before?

Has all the supposed billions spent on R+D not taught auto makers how to prevent rattles? Billions of R+D money hasn't taught them to use high quality electrical connectors and rubbers? All this engineering experience should be overlooked because of some new geometry and body panels? Aaaannnd you want me to pay $100,000 for it?

Should I laugh now or......
 

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Jeepaholic
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Ford struggled with the hardtop supplier from Day One. Many of the order delays are related to the hard top. Ford told customers that if they switch to a soft top, they will get their vehicles quicker. Ford offered credits for a hard top later down the road.

The manufacturer, Webasto, is German owned. Ford has sent engineers into the plant to get quality and production levels up. But Webasto is horribly mismanaged and has not made the situation easier.

I am sure Ford has looked for another supplier, but molding large pieces like this is not like a metal fabricator.

Ford is asking customers to report online any top issues. They are handing credits and replacements out as well. Ford is not waiting, denying or saying "they all do that".

But it does hurt the Bronco launch, like any other all-new vehicle.
As I’ve always said, I don’t mind recalls. Whether the company is forced into issuing one or not, they’re still ultimately addressing a problem. There is nothing worse than having your complaints fall on deaf ears or having to fight with a manufacturer (or dealer for that matter). My family had some epic battles with Ford when I was growing up, and its one of the many reasons we switched to other brands. I took a chance on them when I got my Mustang, but it was more a reflection of what Alan Mulally was able to achieve with them at the time…and how badly frustrated I was with Jeep then. Ford took care of me, Jeep couldn’t have cared less. And our Explorer was more of a reflection of the excellent experience we‘ve had with our dealer rather than Ford themselves.

Back on point though, with all of the recalls for my Liberty, it kept me supplied with free parts for years! So, no, I don’t mind recalls at all! :LOL:

It’s all in how you’re treated. You can forgive mistakes much more easily when you perceive you are being treated well and/or fairly. Even small mistakes piss you off that much more when you’re being treated like crap too. And this isn’t brand specific, we’ve had good and bad experiences from all the brands we’ve purchased from, so I try (and sometimes fail) to not run too hot or cold on any brand.
 
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As I’ve always said, I don’t mind recalls. Whether the company is forced into issuing one or not, they’re still ultimately addressing a problem. There is nothing worse than having your complaints fall on deaf ears or having to fight with a manufacturer (or dealer for that matter). My family had some epic battles with Ford when I was growing up, and its one of the many reasons we switched to other brands. I took a chance on them when I got my Mustang, but it was more a reflection of what Alan Mulally was able to achieve with them at the time…and how badly frustrated I was with Jeep then. Ford took care of me, Jeep couldn’t have cared less. And our Explorer was more of a reflection of the excellent experience we‘ve had with our dealer rather than Ford themselves.

Back on point though, with all of the recalls for my Liberty, it kept me supplied with free parts for years! So, no, I don’t mind recalls at all! :LOL:

It’s all in how you’re treated. You can forgive mistakes much more easily when you perceive you are being treated well and/or fairly. Even small mistakes piss you off that much more when you’re being treated like crap too. And this isn’t brand specific, we’ve had good and bad experiences from all the brands we’ve purchased from, so I try (and sometimes fail) to not run too hot or cold on any brand.
2013 Dodge Dart 2.4 owners who still have not had the oil consumption issue addressed.
 
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