Allpar Forums banner

21 - 40 of 366 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,620 Posts
Americans vote with their wallets. They rejected the global designs from GM and Ford. The Chevy Malibu went from the larger generation model designed here in America and midwifed by Bob Lutz, to a jelly bean, one size fits all continents model. Malibu sales have been in a free fall since then. How are the Euro designed Ford Fiesta and Focus doing here?

Mark my words, if all Chrysler (the brand) becomes is restyled Peugeots, kiss it goodbye. Remember what happened to Pontiac. That brand became nothing but badge engineering. The LH cars enjoyed success that the AMC/Eagle Premier and Dodge Monaco failed to achieve, because he LH sedans were designed closer to Americans' preferences.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
I think the Chrysler And Dodge brands will be okay. I think three things might happen: the use of the Alpha Romeo platform will be finally be used, their own midsize or fullsize platform or simply "badge engineering". I like to see the Opel vehicles be used and change the front and back, trim and engines. Let the Chrysler group develop their own bodies and interiors.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
37,836 Posts
  • Like
Reactions: David S

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,675 Posts
I'm done. We (Chrysler and Dodge fans) have been fed a steady diet of rumors, speculation, and paint & decal packages for many years now.

I will not believe a single new or replacement vehicle is coming for either brand until we see it with our own eyes.

Show me the product.
Done with WHAT exactly? We haven't even begun this merger process. Give Mr. Tavares his due, he basically resurrected Opel, and turned PSA around. He wanted to merge Nissan and Chrysler a decade ago when he was President of Nissan USA.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ScramFan and tlc

·
Banned
Joined
·
4,087 Posts
Done with WHAT exactly? We haven't even begun this merger process. Give Mr. Tavares his due, he basically resurrected Opel, and turned PSA around. He wanted to merge Nissan and Chrysler a decade ago when he was President of Nissan USA.
Opel sells... less than ever in the last 20 years. He helped them but they've launched just product under PSA and it goes on sale this month. I'm talking about Opel Corsa. It has attractive price.

He slashed a lot of costs. Closed one Opel factory on Germany, killed most of R&D. But also he changed some manufacturing. For example in GM Opel could have up to seven different windshields, Tavares slashed it to two. And so on.

But still GM is paying for some European pension funds. And it's a huge money.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
37,836 Posts
Merger is all about Europe.
But the biggest share of money to be made is in North America. There's little reason to believe this will change. Why else would PSA have been looking at entering the North American market even before this merger was considered.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
4,087 Posts
But the biggest share of money to be made is in North America. There's little reason to believe this will change. Why else would PSA have been looking at entering the North American market even before this merger was considered.
Because they have only Europe. They must diverse their business. And now they've achieved it over night.

AFAIK Europe in case of merger Europe will be neck a neck with US for profits.
 

·
Moderator
Joined
·
10,444 Posts
Americans vote with their wallets. They rejected the global designs from GM and Ford. The Chevy Malibu went from the larger generation model designed here in America and midwifed by Bob Lutz, to a jelly bean, one size fits all continents model. Malibu sales have been in a free fall since then. How are the Euro designed Ford Fiesta and Focus doing here?

Mark my words, if all Chrysler (the brand) becomes is restyled Peugeots, kiss it goodbye. Remember what happened to Pontiac. That brand became nothing but badge engineering. The LH cars enjoyed success that the AMC/Eagle Premier and Dodge Monaco failed to achieve, because he LH sedans were designed closer to Americans' preferences.
I think VW's is the model to emulate: VWAG has been very successful spinning off VWs, SEATs, Skodas and Audis from common underpinnings.

The key has been to limit the sharing to those areas consumers don't see and touch, giving each brand their own distinctive styling, product flavor and marketing positioning.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,046 Posts
Americans vote with their wallets. They rejected the global designs from GM and Ford. The Chevy Malibu went from the larger generation model designed here in America and midwifed by Bob Lutz, to a jelly bean, one size fits all continents model. Malibu sales have been in a free fall since then. How are the Euro designed Ford Fiesta and Focus doing here?

Mark my words, if all Chrysler (the brand) becomes is restyled Peugeots, kiss it goodbye. Remember what happened to Pontiac. That brand became nothing but badge engineering. The LH cars enjoyed success that the AMC/Eagle Premier and Dodge Monaco failed to achieve, because he LH sedans were designed closer to Americans' preferences.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhuleEXuULg
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,046 Posts
Because they have only Europe. They must diverse their business. And now they've achieved it over night.

AFAIK Europe in case of merger Europe will be neck a neck with US for profits.
CapEx for NAFTA is high right because they're building plants for some very high margin vehicles, which has artificially/temporarily depressed NA profitability.

Zero chance Europe comes close to NA profits once Grand Wagoneer, Wagoneer, next generation Grand Cherokee, three row Grand Cherokee are all out in 2022/2023.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,675 Posts
I think VW's is the model to emulate: VAG has been very successful spinning off VWs, SEATs, Skodas and Audis from common underpinnings.

The key has been to limit the sharing to those areas consumers don't see and touch, giving each brand their own distinctive styling, product flavor and marketing positioning.
Fixed it for you. VW is one word, though technically so is AG, but AG is a German abbreviation for joint-stock company. Volkswagen AG > VAG
 
  • Like
Reactions: T_690

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,909 Posts
Because they have only Europe. They must diverse their business. And now they've achieved it over night.

AFAIK Europe in case of merger Europe will be neck a neck with US for profits.
Auto companies have been saying this for years. There's only one way for them to make money, and that's get their capacity in line with sales. What's FCA's and Peugeot's plant utilization percentages? My guess is PSAs is higher then FCA Europe.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
833 Posts
The Dodge brand should be slugging it out for Number 1 or 2 sales spot in the US but someone went and took away all their best sellers. I'm amazed how inept FCA management seems to be.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
99 Posts
.

Then ...

From what entity does the follow-up Chrysler 300 come? Vauxhall ( Insignia )? FCA ?

Quite early, I realize.

It would have to be rather convincing to USA/Canadian Americans to have any sort of success. Not sure an existing Alfa would cut it - they're not normally that sedate ... or better put : Sedate with a convincing edge.

A Badged package would be a sell-out and could easily stumble out of the gate leaving the company in an already established weak position.

Using the Insignia would at least give the impression that the Company was working behind the scenes to make something happen.

300C, though, might only live on in the history books.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PH-MYCSjvRM


Yes, I'm aware it's quite early yet ...

.
I like the exterior styling of the Insignia, don't care too much for the interior though. The future will be interesting for sure. Personally, although I know it won't happen, I would love to see a Chrysler styled Jeep Cherokee (I do like the Cherokee styling but prefer chrome & wood trim).
 

·
Move along, nothing to see here
Joined
·
2,502 Posts
Done with WHAT exactly? We haven't even begun this merger process. Give Mr. Tavares his due, he basically resurrected Opel, and turned PSA around. He wanted to merge Nissan and Chrysler a decade ago when he was President of Nissan USA.
The speculation, the rumors, the belief that product is coming for either Dodge or Chrysler. There have been so many vehicles that are anticipated to be coming and they have all quietly vanished. Even the Charger/Challenger replacements got pushed back again (to 2023 now). The "insiders" have all been silent for quite some time now. Yet Jeep and Ram keep churning out new and replacement vehicles. It's been clear where the direction has been going for several years and I'm of the belief that neither the Dodge or Chrysler brands are strong enough as they currently stand (zero product or aged unupdated product in nearly all segments) to survive the merger. If the new FCA/PSA board does not specifically say, "We want to resurrect Chrysler and Dodge brands" then they're done.

So I'm done hoping. I'm done having the football yanked away at the last second. I'm done speculating on what future vehicles we will see under the Chrysler or Dodge brands. I'll believe it when I see it.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
6,989 Posts
The speculation, the rumors, the belief that product is coming for either Dodge or Chrysler. There have been so many vehicles that are anticipated to be coming and they have all quietly vanished. Even the Charger/Challenger replacements got pushed back again (to 2023 now). The "insiders" have all been silent for quite some time now. Yet Jeep and Ram keep churning out new and replacement vehicles. It's been clear where the direction has been going for several years and I'm of the belief that neither the Dodge or Chrysler brands are strong enough as they currently stand (zero product or aged unupdated product in nearly all segments) to survive the merger. If the new FCA/PSA board does not specifically say, "We want to resurrect Chrysler and Dodge brands" then they're done.

So I'm done hoping. I'm done having the football yanked away at the last second. I'm done speculating on what future vehicles we will see under the Chrysler or Dodge brands. I'll believe it when I see it.
Well they did say that none of the brands will be cut in the merger so that's something.
Never fear, Chrysler lovers, PSA’s Tavares wants to keep you (at https://www.autobison.com/2019/11/never-fear-chrysler-lovers-psas-tavares-wants-to-keep-you/ )
 
21 - 40 of 366 Posts
Top