[Stratuscaster]

I absolutely see the TigerShark 2.4 on Avenger as important.... though the current 2.4 is really okay in that car. Not so much in Compass. Wonder why?

CVT2 versus the 4*TES/62TE would be my guess.

Two completely different vehicles.
The thing killing the Dart, is the Dart.
Too big for a compact, too small for a mid sized, it's capturing folks who want a bigger compact, or a smaller mid sized and that's revealed to be fewer buyers than anticipated.

Sans incentives and financing offers, yes - two different vehicles. WITH those offers in play, the cars are close enough in size to warrant consideration.

I've heard and read it more than a few times - "we were looking at the Dart, but found that we could get an Avenger within 7/8s of what we really wanted at a much cheaper payment."

 

[Bearhawke]

I see Avenger and Dart as two completely different animals. Avenger is for old school customers who like to go fast. Dart hasn't found its customers, and unless they start giving them away no one will know how good it is.

And the irony was that about 40 years ago the Dodge Dart was a large 'compact' whereas the Chrysler Avenger was sold here is the Plymouth Cricket.

 

[MoparNorm]

CVT2 versus the 4*TES/62TE would be my guess.Sans incentives and financing offers, yes - two different vehicles. WITH those offers in play, the cars are close enough in size to warrant consideration.I've heard and read it more than a few times - "we were looking at the Dart, but found that we could get an Avenger within 7/8s of what we really wanted at a much cheaper payment."

The cost is a big point, however the larger issues is that, for less money, you're getting a more useable car in the Avenger.
Larger, better engine selection, and acceptable comfort.

 

[Dave Z]

Strat, I am currently testing the 2.4 in the Compass with the Hyundai six speed automatic. So it's not the CVT. I'm guessing it's the axle ratio but I haven't looked to compare axles yet. Or maybe the gear ratios. Or maybe 62TE is better than the Hyundai but I doubt that. Not that I don't have faith in Chrysler but the 62TE is older and has gotten, I suspect, much less investment.

Might partly be a matter of sound insulation. I suspect gearing because Compass is likely a little heavier, and has more aero drag, so they'd be working harder to keep it in high gears and raise that EPA figure. It seems awful slow off the line but it's OK otherwise. Oh, and it seems to need to downshift more at highway speeds. Again... gearing.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

Strat, I am currently testing the 2.4 in the Compass with the Hyundai six speed automatic. So it's not the CVT. I'm guessing it's the axle ratio but I haven't looked to compare axles yet. Or maybe the gear ratios. Or maybe 62TE is better than the Hyundai but I doubt that. Not that I don't have faith in Chrysler but the 62TE is older and has gotten, I suspect, much less investment.

Might partly be a matter of sound insulation. I suspect gearing because Compass is likely a little heavier, and has more aero drag, so they'd be working harder to keep it in high gears and raise that EPA figure. It seems awful slow off the line but it's OK otherwise. Oh, and it seems to need to downshift more at highway speeds. Again... gearing.

That's interesting, Dave.

One has to wonder if the Hyundai 6-speed is just not well-matched to Chrysler engines and axle ratios.

 

[patfromigh]

Try turning off traction control.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

The real marketing lesson from the Dart vs Avenger saga is that people will forego cutting edge features and styling in favor of a good deal.

 

[Dave Z]

I don't think the problem is the transmission but the axle ratio, which could have been changed at the same time.

 

[billfrombuckhead]

I bet we see a spring introduction of the present minivans upgraded with 9 speed automatics and maybe 3.2L Pentastars as 2015 models. Maybe we will also see a Chrysler crossover introduced before the new minivan produced at the same time at the Windsor plant as the present minivan so as to stagger launches.