[Erik Latranyi]

Norm talked about these things in "The Death of Jeep" thread. The Grand Cherokee took Jeep into a new segment of luxury and performance. Wrangler keeps increasing in price and amenities. But was Jeep ready for this?

Yes, it was more than 20 years ago that Jeep entered the premium segment. Every generation of Grand Cherokee (WJ, WK and WK2) took Jeep further upmarket in terms of both luxury and performance (SRT).

Remember, the Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT was the best selling SRT model.

But in those 20 years....under Chrysler, Daimler and Fiat, the company never addressed the fundamental issues.....quality, safety and reliability with superior customer service. At least Cerberus (22 months of ownership) tried with the Customer Advisory Board and the Limited Lifetime Powertrain Warranty.

Now, we see the latest FCA vehicle being given a priority for production, but no priority for quality.

We can only hope that Stellantis reacts to this and breaks the 20 year cycle of incompetence.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

So let me get this straight. These vehicles are run through a multitude of tests to detect rattles, etc. But body panel/door alignment doesn't matter ...

Yes, great point!

The company made a big marketing splash about its testing to improve quality (which was nothing magical as most of the industry does the same already).

It shows that fluff and marketing are still more important than quality.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

As they did when Fiat came in and introduced its various tools for checking the alignment of each car's body panels.

None of this works if plant management tells people they have ten minutes per car and if it doesn't work, ship it and the dealer will do it.

That may work at Mercedes but Jeep dealers generally don't do any real prep. They only charge for it.

It has to go higher than the plant management. It must come from the brand CEO and from the CEO themselves.

This is up to Christian Meunier to correct. He needs to set the expectations of quality and not allow this.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

Looks like a stamping problem tbh. The top part right above the light lines up with the 1/4 but the lower details below the light don’t line up at all. One of gm big full size suv has a messed up highlight due to a stamping defect that wasn’t due to them, but the supplier, so stuff like this can happen.

Stamping dies are specified by the manufacturer, not the supplier. The dies are made to the manufacturer's drawings and if they are out of specification, then nobody checked them, which is the manufacturer's fault.

This quality all goes right to the top of the organization and must be driven downward.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

At the end of the day yes it is their job to make sure everything is perfect but the majority of the time stampings are coming from a supplier of some sort that really fucked up. I know for a fact someone at the supplier messed up the highlights for the gm vehicle as no company would ever release highlights like that between the designers and math team.

Having been a supplier with dies, I can tell you that if the manufacturer cares about quality, they will force the supplier to make new dies or correct the current dies.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

I sent the picture to Christian Meunier and let him know it was getting social media attention.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

As far removed as top management can be, they/he might not even be aware of it. Of course surprise visits to the plants can have big benefits as well.

If he does not react to the picture and the fact that its trending on social media, then he does not deserve the job.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

so you want to P-off Customers that have been waiting since March for their orders on Models thats been already tough to build because of the Chip shortage?

Yes.

That is better than delivering a product with subpar quality.

Ford is doing with the Bronco due to hard top issues. Customers have been waiting nearly a year for their vehicle, but Ford will not deliver until the hard top issue is resolved.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

At a central PA dealer. $87k Wagoner Series II misaligned and condensation in the lamp housing

 

[Erik Latranyi]

Thats not Misaligned, the Chrome Strip on the liftgate just isnt the same shape as the outer strip as if it was Designed that way. The Lamps and Door itself are perfect.

The right side is perfectly aligned.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

Ram and Dodge were one and two in J.D Powers 2021 US initial Quality, and Jeep is above the industry average. Someone has been looking at the quality. These surveys matter to a lot of buyers.

That is initial quality.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

For how expensive the vehicle is i'd rather it say "America" "American Made" or "Made In America" It's too classy of a vehicle to try and dumb it down to terms like that (also not spelled the "correct" way)

They have an American flag on the side of the non-export vehicle.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

Ford is known to have difficulty in executing its manufacturing properly. Aside form interior materials that do not inspire quality, the actual production is filled with problems as evidenced by many launches.

Rather than compare to Ford, compare the Wagoneer to a Hyundai or Kia that costs 1/4 of a Wagoneer and comes with fit/finish far superior.

It is all about manufacturing process and testing/reliability.

Additionally, FCA software has been a big source of reliability problems. That is why Tavares brought in Ned Curic as Chief Technology Officer from Amazon Alexa so he could put in place better software creation systems and testing.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

I would think the 30k Ram would benefit from all the plant upgrades, especially the paint jobs.

Yes, if you build a $100k Wagoneer in the same plant as a Ram pickup, the changes should raise the quality level of all the products in that plant.

In fact, every time a plant receives upgrades, the products should see an improvement as a result.

The problem with FCA is that while they invested in plant upgrades (one of their most positive actions) they kept squeezing suppliers and reduced testing, resulting in many quality and reliability issues.

Until this Wagoneer issue, we did not see many assembly problems under FCA (other than wrong axles due to botched line sequencing). Brampton still has body panel alignment issues, even after the 2015 refresh. How much is due to part design vs plant infrastructure is hard to tell.

But some anecdotal reports say the Wagoneers may have the alignment under control now. We will see as many reviews will be taking place.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

There is ZERO excuse.

Every auto manufacturer ramps up production slowly to work out problems exactly like this so they can put checks and processes in place to prevent them from leaving the plant.

Some companies do better at this than others. It all depends on top management setting the priorities.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

Just like the plant emissions, Stellantis will be cleaning up many messes left by FCA.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

Hope it’s not too late, and sorry for my previously pessimistic (extremely) take.

I think actions have been taken to correct this.

If anyone sees a Wagoneer with misaligned body parts, get a picture and location and send it to me.