[d150le]

I have never worked in any type of assembly plant (auto or otherwise)

I still believe auto workers that are aware of parts that are out-of-spec or poorly made, which makes proper assemble not feasible, should notify their supervisor or quality control employee (whether management or not). Unionized auto workers have union representatives that they can notify of poor quality issues - unless they don’t care about their work and quality of the finished product.

It's obvious. What you're failing to understand in these types of companies is that if any one person above you in the chain of command disagrees with your issues and you're stopping the line, you're losing your job.

 

[Bob Lincoln]

It's obvious. What you're failing to understand in these types of companies is that if any one person above you in the chain of command disagrees with your issues and you're stopping the line, you're losing your job.

Yes. And it's all about bonuses for the higher-ups.
Back in 1993, our parent company in England insisted not only on 20% profit in a 7% industry, they insisted that each month's profit must exceed the previous, regardless of customer spending cycles and budgets.
October fell below September, but was still profitable, and was still better than the previous October. Unacceptable.
So the vice president ordered a furlough for December, to cut the payroll for that month by 10% to make up for the "loss" (the gap between actual profit and desired profit). Each dept would have furloughs to cut their payroll by 10%, regardless of manpower or need. Thus, those depts which had fewer people were furloughed for more weeks.
November turned out to be so profitable that it more than made up for its expectations and October's "gap". So the Director of Product Safety asked the VP in a staff meeting if he would cancel the furlough, since all the cash was now realized.
The VP called him a "f-- a---" in front of everyone and said that the furlough would continue as scheduled. I was out for 2 weeks, as were the rest of my dept co-workers. The company even tried to get some 'essential' people who were furloughed, to work illegally without pay in that time. They refused and their bosses let them know it would be a consideration in their next review. I had to borrow $400 from my retired dad at Christmas to pay my bills - mortgage, insurance, etc.
The VP reportedly got a $40,000 bonus on top of his salary of $250,000 (in 1993) for executing the furlough.
And the beatings were to continue until morale improved.

 

[DC-93]

I have never worked in any type of assembly plant (auto or otherwise)

I still believe auto workers that are aware of parts that are out-of-spec or poorly made, which makes proper assemble not feasible, should notify their supervisor or quality control employee (whether management or not). Unionized auto workers have union representatives that they can notify of poor quality issues - unless they don’t care about their work and quality of the finished product.

In a perfect world, yes, the UAW guy on the line would say the parts don't fit right and the line would stop...

But, plant management says, KEEP ON BUILDING!!!

A rock and a hard place!!

Actually, what I've seen in my 37 years at the various iterations of Chrysler, is that the UAW guys DO care and it's short sighted management that doesn't.

 

[mentalicca]

While I have never worked on an assembly line, in my R&D days where we had to work closely with plants (as in physically bring equipment in to do trial runs), there was definitely a "production over everything" mentality prevalent. This was directly from the top. The individual workers we interacted with had lots of quality/safety ideas. But, generally, upper management wanted numbers. And someone was getting reprimanded or fired whenever a line stopped, even if it was safety related.

There are a LOT of people who want to do things right, but if the only metric that matters is X widgets per Y time, quality, safety, workforce morale, etc. all fall by the wayside. When that is the sole performance metric for bonuses, promotions, salary increases, lay offs, plant shutdowns, among other things, eventually even the most altruist of employees become disillusioned or apathetic.

 

[Bob Lincoln]

While I have never worked on an assembly line, in my R&D days where we had to work closely with plants (as in physically bring equipment in to do trial runs), there was definitely a "production over everything" mentality prevalent. This was directly from the top. The individual workers we interacted with had lots of quality/safety ideas. But, generally, upper management wanted numbers. And someone was getting reprimanded or fired whenever a line stopped, even if it was safety related.

There are a LOT of people who want to do things right, but if the only metric that matters is X widgets per Y time, quality, safety, workforce morale, etc. all fall by the wayside. When that is the sole performance metric for bonuses, promotions, salary increases, lay offs, plant shutdowns, among other things, eventually even the most altruist of employees become disillusioned or apathetic.

One of the worst, and certainly illegal, situations was when my employer would print barcode labels for product not yet built, and scan them on the last day of the quarter and include them in the sales figures, so that the top guys could get their bonuses.
It was also common for them to ship product to customers months before the due date, in order to fudge quarterly sales figures and get bonuses. Imagine you ordered control room equipment in advance for a power plant, knowing the lead time, and it shows up on a pallet, wrapped in plastic, in a muddy field where the plant is not yet built. Unhappy customer, who ships it back with angry communication. My bosses did not care, as long as they got their bonuses.

 

[Dave Z]

Actually, what I've seen in my 37 years at the various iterations of Chrysler, is that the UAW guys DO care and it's short sighted management that doesn't.

There were studies done from the 1960s onwards saying that the people who build cars tend to care more about quality than the plant managers.

Volvo, when they let workers dictate more back in the 1970s, found that productivity stayed the same but quality shot up. Volvo went from a car with a dismal rep to one which was seen as very reliable and solid thanks to Pehr Gyllenhammar.

The next CEO after him decided Mitsubishi was the ideal to be worshipped, and now Volvo belongs to Geely.

Personally, having worked in many companies and having consulted in many more, I have found that the organizational culture is extremely powerful in changing the priorities of each person in the company.

 

[DC-93]

A personal example:

I was in Toluca for the Dodge Journey launch.
I noticed the Pilot cars with dual exhaust had the tips out of alignment.
I brought it up to my boss and he took it up to his. They said it’ll get fixed by volume production.
Next time you are behind a 3.6 Journey tell me what you see!!!!!!!!

 

[Erik Latranyi]

At a central PA dealer. $87k Wagoner Series II misaligned and condensation in the lamp housing

 

[d150le]

There were studies done from the 1960s onwards saying that the people who build cars tend to care more about quality than the plant managers.

Volvo, when they let workers dictate more back in the 1970s, found that productivity stayed the same but quality shot up. Volvo went from a car with a dismal rep to one which was seen as very reliable and solid thanks to Pehr Gyllenhammar.

The next CEO after him decided Mitsubishi was the ideal to be worshipped, and now Volvo belongs to Geely.

Personally, having worked in many companies and having consulted in many more, I have found that the organizational culture is extremely powerful in changing the priorities of each person in the company.

I'm in manufacturing of forestry equipment. I can assure you our most profitable changes in production recently have come via listening to what the guys who actually build the product say will increase productivity and decrease defects. Nobody knows how to build things better, better than the people who actually build them. Big egos, and respect by title are the biggest detrements to productivity.

 

[LouJC]

Greed and narcissism are the negative forces working against what’s left of the US auto industry.

 

[serpens]

Greed and narcissism are the negative forces working against what’s left of the US auto industry.

I'd say those forces are working against most businesses worldwide.

 

[Adventurer55]

In most businesses profit and shareholder value is placed above everything. Nothing wrong with profits, but cutting corners everywhere and squeezing every last ounce out of the company leads to things far worse in the long run. But American companies only plan on short term ideas, nothing long term, unlike the Japanese, but even they have been bit by that thinking to some extent. Probably because their American subsidiaries keep pushing it.

 

[ShawnP]

4 out my 5 Rams are Warren Truck Assembly builds.

Never one major issue and great quality.

What has happened to WTAP?

 

[Adventurer55]

My first new vehicle was a 79 W-150 built at Warren. I had it a year and noticed a bubble in the paint on the right bedside. I was washing it at the carwash and blew the paint right off of it. Turns out the metal underneath wasn't prepped right and was rusty. I had two Ramchargers from there, an 80 and 84. They weren't bad.

 

[Donte Lindsey]

I have never worked in any type of assembly plant (auto or otherwise)

I still believe auto workers that are aware of parts that are out-of-spec or poorly made, which makes proper assemble not feasible, should notify their supervisor or quality control employee (whether management or not). Unionized auto workers have union representatives that they can notify of poor quality issues - unless they don’t care about their work and quality of the finished product.

I could be wrong but I recall seeing a video from the original Chrysler or maybe Diamler Chrysler saying and showing how they stopped the line when a worker sees an issue with the vehicle.

 

[tomaz]

View attachment 83433

At a central PA dealer. $87k Wagoner Series II misaligned and condensation in the lamp housing

Thats not Misaligned, the Chrome Strip on the liftgate just isnt the same shape as the outer strip as if it was Designed that way. The Lamps and Door itself are perfect.

 

[Erik Latranyi]

Thats not Misaligned, the Chrome Strip on the liftgate just isnt the same shape as the outer strip as if it was Designed that way. The Lamps and Door itself are perfect.

The right side is perfectly aligned.

 

[Dave Z]

I could be wrong but I recall seeing a video from the original Chrysler or maybe Diamler Chrysler saying and showing how they stopped the line when a worker sees an issue with the vehicle.

Chrysler around 1997-99. Yes, they did implement that, briefly, but Daimler killed it.

 

[mentalicca]

It for sure was NOT the Daimler era showing a line stop, at least not if it was an honest video. During that era the goal was dropping total time between cars rolling off the line, at all costs. Well at least the Wrangler/Liberty plants. If I recall, the goal was 48 seconds. As soon as a car rolled off the line, the timer restarted. I can ask my family and friends again the final number they actually got to during that time, but nobody seemed very pleased about working the line then.

 

[joewho]

In addition to the “crack management team” - do any of the assembly workers have any concern for the poor work and the product going out the door?

at the end of the day management has final say on what's acceptable to ship and what isn't.