[valiant67]

remember what killed the 200..interior size.

Not as much size as poor layout, the roofline compromised entry into the front and rear seats. Once in, room wasn’t bad.

 

[valiant67]

The 9-speed problems should be rightly addressed to ZF. Every single customer using this transmission had the same issues. The bigger problem is that FCA was the only one using it in non-premium brands, and the less you charge for a product, the more people are likely to complain. (Case in point, Range Rover, whose Evoque has the same problems, but buyers just accept it as part of the price to own a Range Rover)

Blaming ZF does no good. FCA chose them as a supplier. once you chose a supplier, their issues become your issues.
FCA also made certain decisions that amplified the 9 speed issues.

 

[valiant67]

There’s a tendency on here to assume that the reason why the 9-speed had customer problems was because FCA modified it - that’s not true, and it’s frequently used to build a narrative that FCA cost-cuts itself into problems. The 8HP was similarly modified, and I don’t hear complaints about that.

It’s true that a supplier’s issues are your issues, but to blame the final manufacturer for the failure of that supplier to resolve those problems, when only the supplier could have resolved them, is playing a bit too dumb on a forum populated by people who are enthusiasts and know a bit more than Average Joe about how the car industry works.

For the record, yes, it hurt FCA’s reputation, not ZF’s, but that doesn’t make the root cause FCA’s. ZF was a trusted supplier with a proven track record from the 8HP series, a transmission that FCA also modified under license to great success. Applying hindsight to what was a sound decision at the time based on the available evidence is just moaning.

I know how industries work, You make assumptions and we know that that means.
If a supplier has a problem you get them to fix it or you find another supplier. It really is just that simple, though lead times are longer in some industries. And you take the blame rather than attempting to deflect blame. That's what integrity is. Chrysler has long been associated with poor transmissions among the FWD products going back decades, right or wrong, and the 9 speed simply confirmed this reputation to many purchasers.

 

[valiant67]

For those not familiar, there has been a lot of bragging about World Class manufacturing (WCM) at FCA (And I assume continuing with Stellantis).
Part of WCM is root cause analysis. You don't stop root cause analysis process simply because you trace the problem to a supplier. You identify the problem and fix it. Or you're just using WCM certification as a trophy, not a way of business.

 

[valiant67]

I don’t know why you imply that WCM processes were ignored here, because both FCA and ZF made several updates to the transmission software and components to minimise the effect of the dog-gear changes. But ultimately, that knocking is a characteristic of how the transmission was designed, just as much as a whine is a characteristic of a CVT.

First, if the shortcoming of the 9 speed weren't uncovered during testing, the testing process is deeply flawed.
Second, if an assumption was made that these "strange shifts" were OK, the people making those types of decisions are obviously out of touch with the target market.
Third, it's not just the dog-clutch shifts that are the problem Other shifts are rough and jolting, slow engagement, the list continues.
Everything below is my assumption:
Decisions were made by those who didn't know the target market or were more concerned with costs that customer satisfaction. ZF even tried blaming American drivers for the issues.

 

[valiant67]

So...

For example. Aisin is able to build so many transmissions or maybe they are willing to let FCA to build it?

Irrelevant to 9 speed discussion.

 

[valiant67]

An AWD Dart caught testing sounds like the basis of the rally car, since it ran a 2L turbo with AWD.
I'm not under the belief that they were going to take it seriously. Even if it ran the GME is very early testing, the only transmission capable of taking that torque was the 9 speed, unless they bought another transmission, but that just reeks of making a new 'SRT4' as expensive as possible, and not cheap like the 2 SRT4's before it.

SRT and AWD were popular rumors of upcoming Dart features 8 years ago.
They advertised Dart like it was an SRT powered AWD rally car. Not a 40 mpg economy car.

Dart SRT: turbo, AWD, 2017

An SRT version of the Dodge Dart finally showed up on Chrysler’s product plans, with an anticipated build date of December 2016. Assuming there are no delays, that would put it firmly into the 2017 model year. Dodge graphics show the Dart has having front wheel drive only, with standard and...

www.allpar.com

 

[valiant67]

Some people do not realize the damage that it did. On top of other transmission issues that other vehicles had as well at the time. So what did they do? They launched another dud that has managed to undo what small bit of progress had been made on the quality front drive line wise. What they should do is back their autos with a bullet proof warranty to try and persuade customers.

No, let's shorten the powertrain warranty. That way we can keep cost down.
Nothing like a problematic transmission and a shorter warranty to keep repeat buyers away.