By the way, you are wrong on the Fiat platforms.
1996 Palio>Mobi, Palio II, Uno II, Grand Sienna, Fiorino III, Argo/Cronos, Strada,
2001 Stilo>Viaggio/Ottimo
2007 500>Panda Mk 3,
2005 Punto>500L, 500X, Tipo, Toro
Miata>124 Spider
Mild Hybrid engines make the Termoli plant central for the Stellantis group
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1996 Palio>Mobi, Palio II, Uno II, Grand Sienna, Fiorino III, Argo/Cronos, Strada,
2001 Stilo>Viaggio/Ottimo
2007 500>Panda Mk 3,
2005 Punto>500L, 500X, Tipo, Toro
Miata>124 Spider
Viaggio and Dart are CUSW, so are derivatives of the Alfa Romeo Giulietta, not FIAT Tipo. The two are unrelated.
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Let's say that all above is true, which isn't, you are still forgetting modern development tools like a lot of topographic optimization and computational development.
What's carry over is base geometry. Even it is changed to some degree or almost completely. We are not confined with 80's or even 90's development tools. Of course development takes time and R&D center in India must do their work.
To make it straight. Your view on platforms is wrong.
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Not quite. The Giulietta platform was a development of the Fiat Bravo / Lancia Delta platform derived from the 90's Bravo / Brava / Marea platform developed from the original 1987 Tipo platform.
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A lot of wrong info.
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We know how you feel about PSA. We can do without the passive-agressive condescending nonsense.AFAIK 1.5 turbo with hybrid gearbox isn't coming to US. At least according to current plans. Maybe they don't want to risk with MHEV in the US. But PHEV should come.
Yes, of course, PSA transforms water into wine.
Nope. Giulietta (C-Evo) was pretty much all-new, sharing only a handful of components with Bravo. Here's a diagram of the platform parts showing what was new and what was retained:
Small-Wide and Project 160 Tipo are completely unrelated: the name "Tipo" is the only thing that the 1988 and 2015 cars share.
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Seen that thing run. Quite spectacular and seriously quick for its time - actually seriously quick even now.Yeah, sure, but you forgot this:
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Are you absolutely certain on that? 50 years experience of Fiat has taught me tha nothing is ever what it seems or even remotely new most of the time. If you look at other iterations of that platform using torsion beam suspension there are more carry over parts as well - the back was modified to take the Giulia's IRS. You do realise that Fiat constantly recycle and redevelop designs for way longer than most manufacturers and that will have very ancient roots by today's standards.....and it still has better packaging than the PSA platforms.Nope. Giulietta (C-Evo) was pretty much all-new, sharing only a handful of components with Bravo. Here's a diagram of the platform parts showing what was new and what was retained:![]()
Small-Wide and Project 160 Tipo are completely unrelated: the name "Tipo" is the only thing that the 1988 and 2015 cars share.
Yes, I am.
You will find the same "old designs" in every car manufacturer's products, because engineers do not throw out good solutions unless something very much better arrives, and Quality Management systems discourage the replacement of reliable solutions with different designs. The same designs reappear, but stronger, lighter, or manufactured more efficiently. Genuine "Clean-sheet" designs are incompatible with the principles of Quality Management: quality is preserved by managed transition, while wholesale replacement of a design risks introducing defects through all parts of the product.
However, there comes a point where the number of changes is too great to still keep saying that the product is the same as it was. C-Evo was a completely new unibody design, with new crash-protection features, new weight saving measures, new steering options, provision for AWD, different electrics, A/C and suspension systems. It shares some key dimensions (including the only-average rear-seat space) with the Bravo because it was assembled using the same equipment as that car.
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C-Evo and Compact platforms differs in 2 very important features. One is firewall design and positioning. The other are suspension attachment points. With these changes we can call C-Evo an all new platform.
One more thing which @allparman got wrong. Tipo Due platform and Compact platform are totally unrelated. One important feature about Tipo Due platform. It never used torsion beam rear suspension. Even the least expensive version of it had trailing arms at the rear.
70% new. Which is not all new, I expect 90%+ new for that term.Nope. Giulietta (C-Evo) was pretty much all-new, sharing only a handful of components with Bravo. Here's a diagram of the platform parts showing what was new and what was retained:![]()
Small-Wide and Project 160 Tipo are completely unrelated: the name "Tipo" is the only thing that the 1988 and 2015 cars share.
"The first generation Fiat C-platform was directly derived from the Type 2,and is also called "Type Two rev. 2"." C2 in 2001 was a new platform, C-Evo and CUSW evolved from that
Type Two platform - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
Fiat C-platform - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
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AFAIK it's alive and kickin'.
It’s usually a good idea to pay attention when Superduckie posts somethingAFAIK it's alive and kickin'.
You must really hate when Toyota uses that term to sell their Camrys with updated fascia's.
Yes, the Camry was essentially the same from '01 to '17, but the '18 model actually was new, only the V6 carried over.
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