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Chris Monaco said:
Is the 300 not selling that well? Not sure that the market for large family sedans was that large, but I never got the impression that they weren't selling well.

A 300 wagon would be AWESOME. The critics would drool over it, but I'm not entirely sure the U.S. market was there. The CTS Wagon was incredible, but was killed off. In Europe, a Lancia Thema wagon has a better shot.
(and would look great: http://www.allpar.com/news/index.php/2011/07/a-second-chance-for-the-magnum)

If we see the revival of the Dodge Magnum, a 300 wagon should be easy to make. I just hope the market is there to justify Sergio doing what he hates: two similar models in showrooms.


On another note, with the new 200 on the way, I think Dodge and Jeep have HUGE holes to fill before more models can be considered for Chrysler.
I said that it was not selling as well as Chrysler HOPED. The Charger outsells it and the first gen LX sold like hotcakes for it's first few years. I think Chrysler hoped for a similar success with the second gen.
I don't believe there is a chance for a new Magnum at all. Properly, it should be a Chrysler/Lancia since the model would sell better in Europe than here. I would welcome a 300 Estate/Town and Country. As a Magnum owner, I'd prefer something a tad more upscale this time around, especially having spent some time recently in the 2013 200. The Magnum felt a bit old when I got it back, sad to say.
 

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jimboy said:
I said that it was not selling as well as Chrysler HOPED. The Charger outsells it and the first gen LX sold like hotcakes for it's first few years. I think Chrysler hoped for a similar success with the second gen.
I don't believe there is a chance for a new Magnum at all. Properly, it should be a Chrysler/Lancia since the model would sell better in Europe than here. I would welcome a 300 Estate/Town and Country. As a Magnum owner, I'd prefer something a tad more upscale this time around, especially having spent some time recently in the 2013 200. The Magnum felt a bit old when I got it back, sad to say.
I'd take a new Magnum. Everything from the dumbler era feels old now
 

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Think the 300 would sell better if they put in more comfortable seats. Seriously. They look great but ... the 300M still beats the crap out of the 300C when it comes to seating.

That and touchy throttle and brakes are my only complaints. When you have a luxo-barge, you should be able to easily drive it smoothly, and that means less tip-in and less grabby brakes. (Well, equally grabby, but not so much in the first bit of pedal travel.)

Gas mileage might be hurting it, real and perceived. highway mileage is great, city mileage is blah.
 

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Seagondollar said:
When I rented a red Magnum (4 or 5 years ago?) it seemed like everyone complimented it on it's looks.
I still get lots of compliments on the style, and many people tell that they wanted to buy one but either waited too long, or didn't trust Chrysler product at the time. Had Chrysler not given up so quickly on the Magnum, it would have developed a larger and more loyal following.
I think Cadillac is making the same mistake with the CTS wagon, one generation just isn't enough to develop a loyalty, and if they want success in Europe, a wagon is a necessity. I am actually considering a CTS wagon as my next purchase, since Chrysler won't satisfy me with a wagon in any of it's product line.
 

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The first gen 300 was heavily fleeted and had a base car that was worthy of....well nothing. Nasty looking cloth seats with a smattering of options. It had a base price of $23.5k

The current gen 300 bases at $30k and comes standard with a good array of options (leather / dual HVAC, etc...). I'm willing to bet the profit margins on the current 300 are considerably better then the first gen.

Fewer sales does not equal less profit.
 

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My parents looked at the Magnum and chose a Volvo wagon instead. Their complaints were that the wagon did not have enough space, the interior was more like their old Rambler American than a car costing that much, and it felt too stiff and heavy on the road. Mainly it was a matter of space, for a bit more money they got a Volvo that was lower to the ground but had much more cargo space, was far more comfortable, and got better mileage.

That was before Ford bought Volvo, I think. They did get another Volvo after that one -- their Volvos have been very well made and reliable. Funny thing is, the new Volvo's gauge cluster looks as though it’s a revised 300M.


The first gen 300 was heavily fleeted and had a base car that was worthy of....well nothing. Nasty looking cloth seats with a smattering of options. It had a base price of $23.5k The current gen 300 bases at $30k and comes standard with a good array of options (leather / dual HVAC, etc...). I'm willing to bet the profit margins on the current 300 are considerably better then the first gen.
I think on leases, they certainly do have a higher profit, because any decent lease from the first generation would be painfully expensive for Chrysler due to the low resale values. The current one, by making leather standard and the base model more consistent with the C, has much higher residuals and therefore leasing is less costly.

The other thing about the first gen is the 3.5 V6, while a strong engine in the 300M, was not strong enough for all the added weight, esp with the four-speed it had in the first years. My impression with the first generation 300 was that the 300C was the car that had real value -- I wouldn't get a 300. I know others disagree and that's OK, but not until the eight-speed do I think the V6 LX cars were worthwhile. Amusingly the police in my town have switched to the V6 Chargers, -- with the five speeds. But by the time they stop making those for the police, Chrysler will be able to point to reliability and durability among the civvie cars.
 

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To me, the Magnum wagon was for a more optimistic era. It was the vehicle that could do more than one thing (but not all, such as a minivan or sport ute could). When people could afford a second or third vehicle at the same time, Magnum was the vehicle of choice for those that wanted a bit of style. Practicality was never really part of the original formula. If it had continued and if the economy had not proceeded into the toilet, it could have been successfully marketed to peple of means with an aggressive refresh.

I just found a red 08 SRT8 for sale. The seller is asking an almost new vehicle price for it. Guess they are waiting for just the right kind of purchaser......
 

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Charger Red said:
I just found a red 08 SRT8 for sale. The seller is asking an almost new vehicle price for it. Guess they are waiting for just the right kind of purchaser......
For whatever reason the 08s have much higher asking prices than the earlier MSRTs due to the minor fascia & hood changes... I've seen several 06-07 MSRTs in the sub-$15 range with the same miles as an R/T Charger at that price. I would not mind a current-gen Lx Magnum, in fact I'd justify buying one of those in SRT trim a lot easier to the wife than the Charger in SRT trim. Sadly, I can't get that. Ralph has a voice but I guess it's not loud enough :(
 

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Magnum didn't sell all that well, ... pretty much, ever. I think for the most part, the station wagon niche has died in the US as crossovers and minivans got better. Though in all fairness, wagons never sold all that well. I think the FWD wagons sold a lot better than the RWD ones, because they were not priced much higher than sedans... but compare Legacy Wagon vs Outback sales, or really any wagon vs any sedan.
 

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Intrepidatious said:
The first gen 300 was heavily fleeted and had a base car that was worthy of....well nothing. Nasty looking cloth seats with a smattering of options. It had a base price of $23.5k

The current gen 300 bases at $30k and comes standard with a good array of options (leather / dual HVAC, etc...). I'm willing to bet the profit margins on the current 300 are considerably better then the first gen.

Fewer sales does not equal less profit.
i say it again...the 300 is too expensive. compare a loaded charger v8 with a similarly loaded v8 300 and there is minimally a 5k difference in price!! that's huge for what is essentially the same car sans styling. when compared to the charger, the 300 doesn't appear to be a great value.
 

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Two different audiences. One is looking for luxury, the other is looking for Sport. You get what you pay for.
 

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suzq044 said:
Two different audiences. One is looking for luxury, the other is looking for Sport. You get what you pay for.
I'll second that. My parents bought a 2013 300C (fully loaded) last summer. When they were shopping for it, my mom kinda balked at the price. I mentioned a Charger is essentially the same car, and she said "Yea...but a 300 is more of a luxury car, a Charger is more of a performance car". It's a perception thing.
 

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i say it again...the 300 is too expensive. compare a loaded charger v8 with a similarly loaded v8 300 and there is minimally a 5k difference in price!! that's huge for what is essentially the same car sans styling. when compared to the charger, the 300 doesn't appear to be a great value.
They are NOT the same vehicle. A Charger R/T Max compared to a loaded 300C are not directly comparable. There are more options in the 300 and the overall trimming is much nicer. Just because YOUR eyes don't discern a huge difference doesn't mean there isn't one, there is.
 

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JRS200x said:
They are NOT the same vehicle. A Charger R/T Max compared to a loaded 300C are not directly comparable. There are more options in the 300 and the overall trimming is much nicer. Just because YOUR eyes don't discern a huge difference doesn't mean there isn't one, there is.
Just as an example you can get the dual pane panoramic sunroof on the 300 but NOT the Charger, one of the reasons I would prefer a 300 to a Charger even though I prefer the exterior looks of the Charger. Last I checked you can't get the fancy real-wood trim in the Charger either. It actually is a more luxurious car for sometimes the same price with the same (or more) options & trim!
 

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Exactly. Dual-pane sunroof, REAL wood trim, more sound deadening, accoustically laminated windows, rear sun shade, etc etc


Don't get me wrong, the R/T Max is a great package and an absolute bargain, but it is not directly comparable to the 300C.


It is NOT the Dodge version of the 300 in reality.
 

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DaveAdmin said:
... not that I can tell the real wood in the 300C from the faux wood in the 300M.
The feel is totally different and so is the "glare" or "sheen". I had a 1999 LHS which had the same wood trim as the 300M. Night and day difference to the 300C Luxury Editions I've sat in. I think sometimes we fondly remember past models (and I'm guilty of it with that LHS) and don't give enough credit to just how good the current models are.
 

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Tomguy said:
For whatever reason the 08s have much higher asking prices than the earlier MSRTs due to the minor fascia & hood changes... I've seen several 06-07 MSRTs in the sub-$15 range with the same miles as an R/T Charger at that price. I would not mind a current-gen Lx Magnum, in fact I'd justify buying one of those in SRT trim a lot easier to the wife than the Charger in SRT trim. Sadly, I can't get that. Ralph has a voice but I guess it's not loud enough :(
They perfected the look just in time to kill it.
 
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