Time will tell; as might a compression test.
PT Overheated
Question today on my 02 PT she overheated pretty bad. The fan is the culprit. Im going to trouble shoot if it's the actual fan motor itself or the wiring. I pulled over in the closest safe spot and the car was in the red "H" zone for under a minute total but it was steaming clouds of steam and also the overflow tank was bubbling and shaking and puking coolant. Y'all think I blew the head gasket or warped the head or do you think the coolant was just boiling from the hot temperature?
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The car is already down on compression in cylinder 4 because a ring issue, but after it overheated and I let it cool off it still runs fine so it has enough compression to run. I'll definitely do another compression test though if I still have overheating problems after the fan issue is fixed.Time will tell; as might a compression test.
Another, surer way to verify a headgasket issue, is a coolant chemical test.
I've had a car with bad piston ring sealing on a specific cylinder, because coolant was allowed to enter the cylinder for long enough to mix with the oil on the cylinder walls. If this 'head gasket leak' is allowed to continue for too long, it can harm an engine.
Start at the fan motor & see of you can power it up directly to test it. Any P0480 fault code?
Start at the fan motor & see of you can power it up directly to test it. Any P0480 fault code?
I will for sure test for exhaust gases in the cooling system if it continues to overheat after putting everything back together, already rented the tester from the auto part store just in case.Another, surer way to verify a headgasket issue, is a coolant chemical test.
I've had a car with bad piston ring sealing on a specific cylinder, because coolant was allowed to enter the cylinder for long enough to mix with the oil on the cylinder walls. If this 'head gasket leak' is allowed to continue for too long, it can harm an engine.
Start at the fan motor & see of you can power it up directly to test it. Any P0480 fault code?
Narrowed it down to a fan issue today. Tried running the AC and the low speed did not kick on, removed the fan from car and tested both the low and high speeds directly to a 12v source, neither worked. Went to the junkyard and bought a used fan, both low and high speeds work directly with 12v, and I plugged it in to the car without installing the fan and turned the AC on, sure enough the fan kicked right on.
Hopefully this was the cause, going to put it back together tomorrow and replace the thermostat while I'm in there already.
On the old Chrysler engines (318, 360, 413, 440) is you let it cool overnight, you usually had a good engine the next morning. Some oil coking, but the iron heads and cylinders were very forgiving. The bimetal (iron block and aluminum heads) did okay and the aluminum engines are hit or miss.
The chemical test will tell the tale. There is also a pressure test, but chemical is more reliable.
The chemical test will tell the tale. There is also a pressure test, but chemical is more reliable.
Which type of metal is used for the pts engine? Also for doing the chemical test. Can I perform the test while theres no coolant in the car or should I wait until after I have the system filled up?On the old Chrysler engines (318, 360, 413, 440) is you let it cool overnight, you usually had a good engine the next morning. Some oil coking, but the iron heads and cylinders were very forgiving. The bimetal (iron block and aluminum heads) did okay and the aluminum engines are hit or miss.
The chemical test will tell the tale. There is also a pressure test, but chemical is more reliable.
Which type of metal is used for the pts engine? Also for doing the chemical test. Can I perform the test while theres no coolant in the car or should I wait until after I have the system filled up?
I think the block is alloy and the head is aluminum. My training was back when everything was iron.You want the system filled so you don't blow the head gasket or warp the head for sure. Once it's filled and the test is negative, you're done. If it's blown, well, you just have to drain it again. With fresh coolant, you can drain it into a clean jug and reuse it.
Update on the situation! Replaced the fan with a junkyard unit that I confirmed worked and replaced thermostat while I was in there.
Car no longer overheats and runs as good as it did before! Will still do the chemical head gasket test tomorrow before returning the rental tool, but from the results I had from my hour long test drive it looks promising that major engine damage did not occur!
Car no longer overheats and runs as good as it did before! Will still do the chemical head gasket test tomorrow before returning the rental tool, but from the results I had from my hour long test drive it looks promising that major engine damage did not occur!
Block is cast iron, head is aluminum. Not a good combination when overheated, really stresses the head gasket.
Note the combustion gas test is only effective if the leak pushes combustion gas into the coolant. Not so if the coolant is pushed into the cylinder which is only evident if the coolant level slowly drops. A boroscope may indicate coolant wash on the piston.
If the timing belt has not been replaced, suggest doing so and have the head pulled and checked for a warp and refurbished. Few dollars more but good for piece of mind (and new valve seals...).
Note the combustion gas test is only effective if the leak pushes combustion gas into the coolant. Not so if the coolant is pushed into the cylinder which is only evident if the coolant level slowly drops. A boroscope may indicate coolant wash on the piston.
If the timing belt has not been replaced, suggest doing so and have the head pulled and checked for a warp and refurbished. Few dollars more but good for piece of mind (and new valve seals...).
Not sure if the timing belt has been replaced just bought this pt about a month ago, vehicle has 140k so if it hasn't it's way overdue lol, I plan on doing it soon though. Did the job on my last pt a few months ago and it wasn't too difficult. I'll consider looking down the cylinders with a borescope. This engine is already on buyed time though, it has a very obvious ring issue with low compression on Cylinder 4, that increases with a teaspoon of oil down the cylinder, along with a strong gas smelling oil. The engine still runs fairly smooth right now, but I probably will end up swapping the engine whenever it loses all compression in that cylinder or if the head is warped. And yeah I'll watch for my coolant level dropping without any visible leaks.Block is cast iron, head is aluminum. Not a good combination when overheated, really stresses the head gasket.
Note the combustion gas test is only effective if the leak pushes combustion gas into the coolant. Not so if the coolant is pushed into the cylinder which is only evident if the coolant level slowly drops. A boroscope may indicate coolant wash on the piston.
If the timing belt has not been replaced, suggest doing so and have the head pulled and checked for a warp and refurbished. Few dollars more but good for piece of mind (and new valve seals...).
However, I don't believe that the head is warped or the head gasket blown. I haven't had any symptoms of either during any of the time I ran it today. Once the car started overheating I got it parked and shut off pretty quick in under a minute.
Why don't you try a soak on cylinder 4 to try to free up the rings? Back in the old days, my dad used a combination of Marvel Mystery Oil and type F transmission fluid. He'd let it sit for a coupe of days and if the compression came up a little, he'd do it again. After 3 times and 6 days, if it didn't work, he'd then decide whether or not to just rebuild the engine. Of course, there's a LOT of different things you can use to soak the rings nowadays. I'm just telling you what worked for my father.
I'll certainly consider doing that. Wouldn't that be more for rings that are stuck? I feel like the rings in my cars engine are just worn from use and properly not proper engine maintenance from the previous owners. I'm considering sourcing an engine for the car now for when it fails.Why don't you try a soak on cylinder 4 to try to free up the rings? Back in the old days, my dad used a combination of Marvel Mystery Oil and type F transmission fluid. He'd let it sit for a coupe of days and if the compression came up a little, he'd do it again. After 3 times and 6 days, if it didn't work, he'd then decide whether or not to just rebuild the engine. Of course, there's a LOT of different things you can use to soak the rings nowadays. I'm just telling you what worked for my father.
The 'soak' may help carboned-up, sticky rings, but I think that yours are worn. Possibly from coolant entering that cylinder? Keep diagnosing.
Imperial Crown is correct. Follow his advice. I was only looking at one side of the coin, so to speak.
I'll keep diagnosing over the next weeks, I'll stick a scope down the cylinders and look, I may just run this engine till it blows and then swap it lol, itd probably be cheaper than rebuilding it.The 'soak' may help carboned-up, sticky rings, but I think that yours are worn. Possibly from coolant entering that cylinder? Keep diagnosing.
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