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Workers have always been expendable. While there have been blips along the way to help keep that from happening, not much has changed and the pandemic has proven this. And even though some believe it's political, it is not. It's all about money, plain and simple.
 

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Virginia Gentleman
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He could have always made the choice to leave the company. Granted, he didn't have much of a choice, but the option was still there.
 

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He could have always made the choice to leave the company. Granted, he didn't have much of a choice, but the option was still there.
Right. Because Malaysia takes such good care of unemployed people.
(Is it actually a choice they can make? I don't know, and I doubt any of us do. In the United States, leaving your job was not always an option; coal miners, as one example, were bound to it unless the employer let them go, because the terms of the job meant they would owe more for food and housing than they were paid; their children would end up working off their debt, in a non-ownership but still real form of slavery, enforced by private thugs and public “law enforcement.” Is Malaysia more advanced than the USA in 1910?)
 

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Jeepaholic
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What other industry can one choose to go work for that is going to a) not be feeling the negative impact of a pandemic, and b) not treat workers like cannon fodder?

As a healthcare professional, I know of colleagues who have had to threaten to go to the media in order to force employers to offer testing after exposures, and to prevent employers from penalizing workers for calling out sick due to exposure as well as for (expected) symptoms after receiving the vaccines. “We don’t want you to come to work sick, but we’re going to give you an occurrence for calling out. And don’t come back until you’re feeling better, just don’t let it be more than 2 days”.

Employers may call you heroes, but their actions speak louder than those empty words.
 

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Virginia Gentleman
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Is it actually a choice they can make? I don't know, and I doubt any of us do.
Good points. We don't know the laws in Malaysia. I was just pointing out there could have been a choice to be made. Sometimes, the choice isn't easy or there are consequences, but regardless, the choice is still there, which was my point. That's why I said, it may not have been much of a choice.
 
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Employers are a lot like politicians, in the fact that they are very good at the art of the spin.
There are good employers out there and you will seldom hear of them as employees are with them for 30+ years. There is little need to have legislative action regarding them. However, the bad ones need strong corrective legislation.
 

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Good points. We don't know the laws in Malaysia. I was just pointing out there could have been a choice to be made. Sometimes, the choice isn't easy or there are consequences, but regardless, the choice is still there, which was my point. That's why I said, it may not have been much of a choice.
Agree, and I hope it's understood I was elaborating rather than disagreeing. Mansplaining, if you will ;)

There are good employers out there and you will seldom hear of them as employees are with them for 30+ years. There is little need to have legislative action regarding them. However, the bad ones need strong corrective legislation.
If we go back before the employer-employee relationship was regulated, we see some abuses people simply would not believe today.
 

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If we go back before the employer-employee relationship was regulated, we see some abuses people simply would not believe today.
A while back, I read on wikipedia that Fiat had a long standing role as the number one worst company as far as employee treatment goes. Without the Italian labor laws nothing would change. In Canada they change laws to suit the automakers, including Federal and Provincial holidays. Although FCA had a good covid precheck and madatory masks, it didn't take long for them to cut back the extra cleanup/keep your distance time given for safety. Atleast at BAP.
 

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Right. Because Malaysia takes such good care of unemployed people.
(Is it actually a choice they can make? I don't know, and I doubt any of us do. In the United States, leaving your job was not always an option; coal miners, as one example, were bound to it unless the employer let them go, because the terms of the job meant they would owe more for food and housing than they were paid; their children would end up working off their debt, in a non-ownership but still real form of slavery, enforced by private thugs and public “law enforcement.” Is Malaysia more advanced than the USA in 1910?)
Funny you should mention Coal Miners, my grandfather worked in the lumber industry for damn near all his life. The company provided him a home and steady employment till the day he contracted throat cancer from Creosote the substance to treat railroad ties. If my Grandfather was to have quit his employment he would lose his home and means to provide for his family. Labor laws from country to country are a touchy subject, thankfully things are slowly changing from pressures around the globe but still prevalent in under developed countries.
 

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I hate to tell you, but even in developed countries safety and other measures are under attack as well. If businesses here had their way here there would be zero labor laws. They are an inconvenience to them and it costs them money.
 

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Devils advocate here. Consumers rarely agree to pay higher prices to offset the cost of higher wages, safety, environmental improvements, etc. That attitude is starting to change, but there have been plenty of posts about how automaker’s should sell vehicles stripped of all modem safety equipment so it’s cheap, screw the morality and ethics of safety.
 
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While living in Malaysia it was pretty apparent with social status, race, profession, and religion. There are tiers and stereotypes of all sorts. Extreme poverty and extreme excess. Police pulled us over because they are not paid enough to live on. So 20 Ringget on the backside of the drivers license plastic holder. Then off you go. The first time my mother tried to directly hand 50 Ringgit to the guy and he was all 'Too much too much!' while she was crying.
I visited a Texas Instruments factory in Kuala Lumpur. They were making calculators. Most of the workforce there were women. I was there when they launched the Proton Saga. It had a neat glowing front emblem above the grill.
What a rambling post...
 

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If we go back before the employer-employee relationship was regulated, we see some abuses people simply would not believe today.
Abuses are why we have unions and the history of early steel and auto industry is a prime example of some of the abuses. It took a few more years before we started to codify the protections and we now have a pendulum that can go both ways. Both sides argue which side it is on.

My personal perspective comes from the fact that at one point of my career I was an hourly union employee managing a parts department of non-union employees.
 

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Jeepaholic
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I don't know much about the whole chip business, but has is no one come up with an alternative?
Assuming you mean an alternative to microchips, it would wonderful if they could, and it would make someone (corporation probably) very rich, but for now this is what we’ve got. If you mean an alternative to the current chip manufacturers, of which there are few, I understand they are trying to expand.

However, because these are such a PITA to make, and very time consuming, and building new manufacturing facilities is difficult and time consuming too, for now it’s “hurry up and wait”. Not to mention all the breakdowns in the shipping and supply chains as well.

I must admit, though, that knowing that these chips are so widely used and in demand, I’m really surprised there isn’t more capacity to make more. I guess like everything else, a pandemic has ways of creating new and interesting ways of exposing flaws or weaknesses in a system. This sucks.
 
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Capacity is very expensive to add, takes several years, and is specific to certain circuit thickness geometries. It's a big risk if that geometry becomes obsolete, or demand fluctuates.
When I started my career, line geometry in microcircuits was 5 um wide. Now it's as small as 4nm (1000x thinner).
 
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