Watch MotorTrend Video, SRT vs ZR1

5886 Views 37 Replies 20 Participants Last post by Muther, Feb 1, 2013

Mr.Source

Discussion Starter · Jan 18, 2013

In my opinion they simply destroyed the VIPER SRT,in few words it was inferior in every area, it didn't stop as good s the ZR1, brakes fade, suspension is inferior, even the seat isn't as comftable as in the ZR1

Motor Trend didn't liked it, and what to say about Pobst, he destoyed it.

It would be very interesting to her wht Ralph has to say, of course not chicken, I mean, is it real all those issues they complained about the VIPER SRT?

http://www.autoblog.com/2013/01/17/motor-trend-pits-srt-viper-against-chevy-corvette-zr1/#continued

21 - 38 of 38 Posts

Mr.Source

Discussion Starter · #21 · Jan 19, 2013

It's very clear for many, that Chrysler keeps making marketing errors, they made a mistake by sending a pre-production car, and the truth IS the SRT VIPER has INFERIOR brakes,and of course it still needs to be improved in many areas.
I can't understand why didn't they wait until the car was already improved and ready to take a challenge.

Now, we all know, because of the media, the SRT VIPER, will be seen as inferior to the Corvette, it's absurd to think that Ralph will talk to magazines and tell them, Our Viper is now ready for a new test, so please run another comparo with the ZR1.

So let's forget about it, so let's hope we will have an improved SRT VIPER in the future, but the truth is we lost at the track.
So when is Chrysler going to learn those small details?

I can't understand why the hurry to launch the SRT VIPER, why?

They lost more than what they gained.

Powdered Toast Man

· #22 · Jan 19, 2013

Last I checked, speed limits in the city were still around 40mph and 70-75mph on the highway. Not sure the point of these comparos. Doubt many people have access to a race track.

JRS200x

· #23 · Jan 19, 2013

Powdered Toast Man said:
Last I checked, speed limits in the city were still around 40mph and 70-75mph on the highway. Not sure the point of these comparos. Doubt many people have access to a race track.

If you don't understand the reasoning behind the comparos, then you don't understand the reasoning behind the cars. Period.

Muther

· #24 · Jan 20, 2013

RG said in a video posted in another thread, that they are going back to Laguna Seca, with MT, and the ZR1 in a couple of months. MT will bring Pobst in the ZR1, and SRT will bring Dominik Farnbacher in the Viper. I am sure SRT will bring a couple engineers, and they will set up the suspension (adjustable caster, camber, toe in and toe out front and rear). The seats will be fixed, along with a few other things. DF is faster than Pobst, any day of the week, too, and he knows the Viper inside and out.

Also, there are very credible rumors, and dyno runs, that suggest the ZR1 was a ringer. 30+ hp at Laguna will make one helluva difference in lap times. (this would be consistent with Chevy's past, and their dealings with MT and Petersen Publishing, who they have been the biggest advertiser in for many years).

Powdered Toast Man

· #25 · Jan 21, 2013

JRS200x said:
If you don't understand the reasoning behind the comparos, then you don't understand the reasoning behind the cars. Period.

I actually don't understand the purpose of these supercars.

Muther

· #26 · Jan 21, 2013

Powdered Toast Man said:
I actually don't understand the purpose of these supercars.

Fair enough. Cars are something many people are very passionate about, the same way some people are passionate about thoroughbred race horses, wine, fine funriture, or even yoga. There really isn't a lot of point to these cars when viewed as transportation. These cars are much less about moving people, rather they are about HOW they moe people.

Many Viper owners do actually take their cars to the track. In fact I have seen more (street licensed) VIpers on tracks (actually on the track lapping), than I have seen on hte street, or in dealers lots. Don't know a whole bunch about ZR1's, I have only seen a ouple, and they aren't that impressive. The Viper's are very impressive, even when you view them as art.

Would I own a Viper? Only if had money to do to other things, and had some left over for a Viper (there are other cheaper cars I would prefer to race over a Viper). They are about as practical as carrying around a bazooka. Driving one around town is like putting a battleship in a farm pond. But WHAT a battleship baby?

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dieselcars&trucks

· #27 · Jan 28, 2013

Perhaps these positioning and marketing mistakes ( as noted throughout the comments here ) are indicative of why Marchionne removed RGilles from Dodge and re-assigned him to SRT ...

freshforged

· #28 · Jan 28, 2013

JRS200x said:
If you don't understand the reasoning behind the comparos, then you don't understand the reasoning behind the cars. Period.

You mean theres reasoning behind these cars? Not sure about that. Cars like the Viper reach out on a visceral and emotional level--not really rational calculation.

Fact of the matter is, there is no rational reason for these cars to exist. They do exists simply because we are not fully rational beings (thank god for that!)

MoparMan

· #29 · Jan 29, 2013

Powdered Toast Man said:
Last I checked, speed limits in the city were still around 40mph and 70-75mph on the highway. Not sure the point of these comparos. Doubt many people have access to a race track.

Actually, access to a track (either drag strip or road course) is easy and a large percentage of Viper owners have tracked their car(s).

JRS200x

· #30 · Jan 29, 2013

freshforged said:
You mean theres reasoning behind these cars? Not sure about that. Cars like the Viper reach out on a visceral and emotional level--not really rational calculation.

Fact of the matter is, there is no rational reason for these cars to exist. They do exists simply because we are not fully rational beings (thank god for that!)

There is absolutely a rational reason to the existance of HALO cars. Which is what these are... They generate excitement for the brand and draw people to the showroom. They elevate the brand in the minds of a lot people simply by existing and give their brand/company cache. Seems pretty damn rational to me.

Muther

· #31 · Jan 29, 2013

Mr.Source said:
It's very clear for many, that Chrysler keeps making marketing errors, they made a mistake by sending a pre-production car, and the truth IS the SRT VIPER has INFERIOR brakes,and of course it still needs to be improved in many areas.
I can't understand why didn't they wait until the car was already improved and ready to take a challenge.

Now, we all know, because of the media, the SRT VIPER, will be seen as inferior to the Corvette, it's absurd to think that Ralph will talk to magazines and tell them, Our Viper is now ready for a new test, so please run another comparo with the ZR1.

So let's forget about it, so let's hope we will have an improved SRT VIPER in the future, but the truth is we lost at the track.
So when is Chrysler going to learn those small details?

I can't understand why the hurry to launch the SRT VIPER, why?

They lost more than what they gained.

It appears very frustrsting. Well, I am sure the Viper will do ll the talking in the end. No matter when the comparo happened it would have ended in the Vette's favor. Ths is MT we are talking about. Look at any copy of MT and compare the ad space GM buys to that which F-C buys. Look at the pictures, count how many GM's you see vs any other make. Count the number of times a GM make, or model is printed.

If Gilles had waited, I am sure it would have been printed in MT that SRT was "Chicken" and wouldn't send us their new toy to thrash. Loss. It is very likely that the "re-match" that is scheduled for the spring was arranged when SRT asked for the Viper in the first place. RG is no amatuer. He already knows the score when it comes to Petersen Publishing and MT vs GM.

If at all possible they go easy on any Chevy, then any GM. If they can't get away with it, then they come up with excuses for the GM stuff. MT is telling Chrysler to buy more ad space. It is that simple.

In the rematch, its Pobst and the ZR1, against Farnbocker and the Viper, at Mazda Laguna Seca. What I would LOVE to see, is not just track time, but a full test. How much power is each applying to the road? What is the average customer's car applying? How much grip does each car get? Again, what is the average? I really don't want a normal Viper cpmared to a +30hp Vette with shaven and pre-heated tires. When SRT shows up, they need to "show up". THey need to bring a tech and an engineer, and make sureh te VIper is at the top of its game.

(A portable dyno set wouldn't hurt either, to keep the Chevy honest.)

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MoparNorm

· #32 · Jan 30, 2013

"He already knows the score when it comes to Petersen Publishing and MT vs GM."
In fairness, there is no longer a Petersen Publishing, it's Source Interlink Inc and they own 70 magazines including MANY Mopar and Jeep magazines and MT selected the Dodge Ram as Truck of the Year.
Source Interlink has many pro Mopar writers, even if the MT mag tends to favor one particular manufacturer, it's not the Petersen of old.

Muther

· #33 · Jan 30, 2013

MoparNorm said:
"He already knows the score when it comes to Petersen Publishing and MT vs GM." Muther

In fairness, there is no longer a Petersen Publishing, it's Source Interlink Inc and they own 70 magazines including MANY Mopar and Jeep magazines and MT selected the Dodge Ram as Truck of the Year.
Source Interlink has many pro Mopar writers, even if the MT mag tends to favor one particular manufacturer, it's not the Petersen of old.

Understood. I knew that the entity fka Petersen Pub had evolved, I was just too lazy to Google it, (or open one of my old MT magazines I have laying around).

Thanks Norm.

MoparNorm

· #34 · Jan 31, 2013

Muther said:
Understood. I knew that the entity fka Petersen Pub had evolved, I was just too lazy to Google it, (or open one of my old MT magazines I have laying around).

Thanks Norm.

No problem! For the record, Petersen did leave a bad taste in the mouths of many. From another perspective, the LA housed Petersen's Automotive Museum, is a masterpiece of automotive history.

Muther

· #35 · Feb 1, 2013

I wonder if RG is less concerned with things as pedestrian as the latest Vette? Maybe he is waiting to introduce the ACR, until after the McLaren P1 comes out? Naw? I expect, too much. I do know one thing, though. It won't sit well with anyone at Connner Avenue if the P1 Macca laps Laguna quicker than the Viper of the Vette, which it most certainly will.

RG and Co covet Laguna.

JRS200x

· #36 · Feb 1, 2013

I am not sure RG is particularly worried about what the P1 does performance wise. They aren't building the Viper to compete with the P1 or the upcoming Enzo replacement. You are talking about vehicles that are priced HUNDREDS of thousands of dollars more. Will the ACR offer similar levels of performance? Probably, but with a lot less refinement. The Viper is already loud inside, the ACR even more so and will offer a lot less amenities, whereas the P1 or Enzo replacement will be "fully loaded" luxurious vehicles that are also immensely capable. Very different class of vehicles.

The Viper goes after supercars.. not hyper cars.

My guess is they would be more concerned with the MP4-12C GT3, when talking about the ACR than the P1.

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dak4x4

· #37 · Feb 1, 2013

This is what happens when you got middle aged men with beards reviewing sports cars, "...the seats are to hard it hurts my buttocks... its too hard to steer....too much noise...i got scared around the turns....etc etc..." These sob sisters are just too old for this...

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Muther

· #38 · Feb 1, 2013

I expect the P1 to set new track records around the world. This car is McLaren's attempt to trump its own extremely high standards in the form of their original F1. The Viper is pretty raw inside (realtive to almost anything but a Lotus Exige), so I don't think SRT would dream of touching the rarity available in cars like the F1, P1, Enzo, F70/150, etc.

However, the Viper is a very, very potent track weapon. The ACR holds an amazing number of tracks records. RG and Co. are very proud of that, and rightly so. Some records they don't care that much about. Two of them are very near and dear to their hearts. The Nordschleiffe (the Nurburgring), and Laguna Seca. The ACR is still the fastest production car to lap the Ring. Only the Gumpert, Donkervoort, and Radical are faster. But those are low volume, Euro, specialty makers, and they are not US road legal, and they are about as streetable as Saturn V. Many people didn't think the Viper ACR could approach the Gumpert Apollo's time, but it was within a few tenths of the Gumpert.

My point is that while the Viper won't touch them regarding their "unobtanium" value, it may very well be able to beat them at the track.

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