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Guys, seriously.

Back in the late 90's, for some still unexplained reason DCX decided there would be no Dodge branded cars in Canada. The second gen Intrepid was sold as the Chrysler Intrepid. The second gen Neon became Chrysler Neon. We didn't even see the second gen Stratus at ALL - I guess because there wasn't enough differentiation between it and the Sebring. The only Dodge models were Caravan, Grand Caravan, Ram, and Dakota.

Guess what? No one even noticed.

I worked on the labour/field side of things for the last 5 years and every single worker, foreman, and trades person still refers to Ram trucks as "Dodge Ram". Frankly the Ram rebranding is a total failure. The only thing it has served to accomplish is weaken the Dodge brand name.

They absolute did the right thing in picking Grand Caravan for the decontented trim vans over Voyager. Voyager hasn't existed in Canada for over 20 years. Grand Caravans outsold Town and Country by about 20 to 1 and Pacificas by about 50 to 1.
 
I worked on the labour/field side of things for the last 5 years and every single worker, foreman, and trades person still refers to Ram trucks as "Dodge Ram". Grand Caravan for the decontented trim vans over Voyager Frankly the Ram rebranding is a total failure. The only thing it has served to accomplish is weaken the Dodge brand name. .
Usually we all refer to the trucks as Dodges, only some will argue they have a Ram Truck. No problem calling the decontented trim vans either Grand Caravan or Voyager, but why have one model name for the US & 1 for Canada? That's as silly as branding the Intrepid as a Chrysler in Canada.
 
Guys, seriously.

Back in the late 90's, for some still unexplained reason DCX decided there would be no Dodge branded cars in Canada. The second gen Intrepid was sold as the Chrysler Intrepid. The second gen Neon became Chrysler Neon. We didn't even see the second gen Stratus at ALL - I guess because there wasn't enough differentiation between it and the Sebring. The only Dodge models were Caravan, Grand Caravan, Ram, and Dakota.

Guess what? No one even noticed.

I worked on the labour/field side of things for the last 5 years and every single worker, foreman, and trades person still refers to Ram trucks as "Dodge Ram". Frankly the Ram rebranding is a total failure. The only thing it has served to accomplish is weaken the Dodge brand name.

They absolute did the right thing in picking Grand Caravan for the decontented trim vans over Voyager. Voyager hasn't existed in Canada for over 20 years. Grand Caravans outsold Town and Country by about 20 to 1 and Pacificas by about 50 to 1.
Yes, at that time Dodge was going to be all trucks in Canada. And then the course was changed again.

I actually don’t think Canadians will care that it’s a Chrysler in Canada or that it has an SXT trim. I think they will care that it sounds like it’s going to be well into the $40K+ range by the time you get an SXT with S&G. It’s starting at the mid or top range of its direct competitors.
 
Yes, at that time Dodge was going to be all trucks in Canada. And then the course was changed again.

I actually don’t think Canadians will care that it’s a Chrysler in Canada or that it has an SXT trim. I think they will care that it sounds like it’s going to be well into the $40K+ range by the time you get an SXT with S&G. It’s starting at the mid or top range of its direct competitors.
Canadians won't care that the GC is a Chrysler. Canada is a very different market than the US. I can tell you the reason why the DGC is such an incredible seller here: VALUE. It's the most versatile vehicle on the market for the money. And they're cheaper than the competition. If they price the Chrysler Grand Caravan above any other van on the market (like Kia) then sales of it will tank. It's the same reason Journey is such a big seller here - there's no other 3 row CUV in the market in that price range. Majority of Canadians shop for value. Maybe its because of our long winters but very few here have the cash to buy a vehicle that's a vanity purchase. And no one is going to winter drive anything high dollar because it gets destroyed by road sand and salt. Even the majority of Chargers and Challengers I see are SXT's.
 
Canadians won't care that the GC is a Chrysler. Canada is a very different market than the US. I can tell you the reason why the DGC is such an incredible seller here: VALUE. It's the most versatile vehicle on the market for the money. And they're cheaper than the competition. If they price the Chrysler Grand Caravan above any other van on the market (like Kia) then sales of it will tank. It's the same reason Journey is such a big seller here - there's no other 3 row CUV in the market in that price range. Majority of Canadians shop for value. Maybe its because of our long winters but very few here have the cash to buy a vehicle that's a vanity purchase. And no one is going to winter drive anything high dollar because it gets destroyed by road sand and salt. Even the majority of Chargers and Challengers I see are SXT's.
Sales taxes, bank rates and fuel prices are higher in Canada, too. And cold winters mean vehicles in Canada need to be replaced sooner than say in California, Arizona or Nevada. All of these conspire to make Canadian buyers more value-oriented in general.

My boss used to say: Canadians have deep pockets, we just have short arms, eh?
 
Discussion starter · #29 ·
Canadians won't care that the GC is a Chrysler. Canada is a very different market than the US. I can tell you the reason why the DGC is such an incredible seller here: VALUE. It's the most versatile vehicle on the market for the money. And they're cheaper than the competition. If they price the Chrysler Grand Caravan above any other van on the market (like Kia) then sales of it will tank. It's the same reason Journey is such a big seller here - there's no other 3 row CUV in the market in that price range. Majority of Canadians shop for value. Maybe its because of our long winters but very few here have the cash to buy a vehicle that's a vanity purchase. And no one is going to winter drive anything high dollar because it gets destroyed by road sand and salt. Even the majority of Chargers and Challengers I see are SXT's.
I know Canada is a different market than the US. However, everything you just said can be applied to the US market. Journey was a big seller due to value, Grand Caravan also sold more than the Pacifica, Charger and Challenger are mostly SXT and GT trims (atleast in the midwest). I hope I am proved wrong and that moving the Grand Caravan name will work for Chrysler. In the US there is a hard time differentiating between Voyager and Pacifica touring/touring L trims. I know for people on forums the differences probably seem obvious, but this is a different story for most people who only look into vehicles once every seven years. I've met many people who don't even know that Chrysler and Dodge are related. I've also met people who will only drive Jeeps or Dodges and won't even consider Chrysler because they believe there is a difference in quality. Wouldn't be surprised if old Grand Caravan owners (both Canada and US) went to the Dodge website, saw that the Grand Caravan is gone, and then moved on to Honda or Toyota's website to look at vans.
 
Dgc quality sucks. The new Pacifica is a huge step up. Better power train and with Grand Caravan name as a base model keeps the strong name recognition and and an easier redirect to the higher end models with a similar price range as the old.

Said it before. Time for the dodge grand caravan to go.
 
Dgc quality sucks. The new Pacifica is a huge step up. Better power train and with Grand Caravan name as a base model keeps the strong name recognition and and an easier redirect to the higher end models with a similar price range as the old.

Said it before. Time for the dodge grand caravan to go.
I know that, you know that, but honestly the Grand Caravan buying Canadian public doesn't care about that. If the sticker price isn't the value leader in the market then Canadians will buy something else.

The ones who shop based on metrics like quality are not buying anything in the FCA camp.
 
I know that, you know that, but honestly the Grand Caravan buying Canadian public doesn't care about that. If the sticker price isn't the value leader in the market then Canadians will buy something else.

The ones who shop based on metrics like quality are not buying anything in the FCA camp.
Yes cause I enjoy driving around in a p.o.s.
 
You may not like it, but FCA is going ahead with it.

Let’s face it, the average buyer doesn’t care if Caravan is a Dodge or a Chrysler. All they care is that it is a Chrysler minivan, and offers Caravan’s value and reputation.
This. Its just like the neon, didn't matter if it was a plymouth, dodge or a chrysler and a lot of mundane Chrysler vehicles share that. You'll now start seeing them all over the place.
 
This is really sad, and it says a lot about what FCA thinks of their Canadian buyers. How hard would it have been to do at least a LITTLE work to make this a Dodge? It's not like they didn't know this would be an issue.
This has nothing to do with what FCA thinks of Canadians. It has everything to do with Dodge now being this niche muscle brand with no room for mainstream vehicles.
 
Discussion starter · #37 ·
We will have to see how it goes now that the Dodge minivan is gone. It would be nice to see Dodge's market share transferred directly to Chrysler. Even in a good economy, I am doubtful that the current Pacifica/Pacifica variations can move 220,000+ per year.
 
Wouldn't be surprised if old Grand Caravan owners (both Canada and US) went to the Dodge website, saw that the Grand Caravan is gone, and then moved on to Honda or Toyota's website to look at vans.
Exactly. Once buyers see that the Grand Caravan isn't an option anymore, they will start shopping for alternatives. In Canada, at least they might come across the Chrysler Grand Caravan, so I do have to give them credit there. In the US, now they're starting over and start cross-shopping. How many of them pick the Pacifica or Voyager? How many of them pick the Sedona? Does FCA just not WANT to sell vehicles?
 
This has nothing to do with what FCA thinks of Canadians. It has everything to do with Dodge now being this niche muscle brand with no room for mainstream vehicles.
Which is a recipe for disaster. I do not understand the strategy here. Dodge can be muscle AND mainstream. Nobody has ever gotten confused because Ford sold a Mustang AND a Focus. Nobody ever decided not to purchase a Corvette because you could also buy a Chevy Trax. Those brands have wisely kept a broader focus while also leveraging the popularity of their halo cars to sell more pedestrian models.

But perhaps the real reason Dodge is a niche brand is that redesigning the mainstream models would cost actual money. Instead you're left with three models that don't really have much competition.
 
Which is a recipe for disaster. I do not understand the strategy here. Dodge can be muscle AND mainstream. Nobody has ever gotten confused because Ford sold a Mustang AND a Focus. Nobody ever decided not to purchase a Corvette because you could also buy a Chevy Trax. Those brands have wisely kept a broader focus while also leveraging the popularity of their halo cars to sell more pedestrian models.

But perhaps the real reason Dodge is a niche brand is that redesigning the mainstream models would cost actual money. Instead you're left with three models that don't really have much competition.
Yer preaching to the choir.

I am with you: putting Dodge into a corner is not a sustainable long-term strategy.

Heck, every day niche brands are trying hard to become mainstream!
 
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