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Today on "Life With Elon"

7.8K views 47 replies 20 participants last post by  KrisW  
#1 ·
#19 ·
The early adopters flocked to the Prius with its "look at me" styling, and those early adopters have now moved on to Tesla cars. Toyota is coming out with the Corolla hybrid in the US and Canada, a new RAV4 hybrid, and a Highlander Hybrid. The prices will be attractive on all these models. It remains to be seen if the new generation RAV4 hybrid will continue to eat Prius sales, but Toyota's strategy of bringing in "normal" hybrids to attract mainstream buyers to their hybrids is working. Most buyers are staying in the showroom, while only the early adopters move on.

There are enough Prius cars on the road with good service records to cement the Toyota hybrid drive's good reliability reputation. Toyota has done their homework and has given both their return and potential customers what the want.
 
#23 ·
Really? The people I work with rave about the looks of their Teslas, inside and out and how they aren't "like other cars".
I worked with engineers in Georgia who were so excited to buy (or lease) a Leaf when the first came out. Once they started giving out the Leaf almost free to everyone, these engineers soon found more unique EVs to drive.
To these people, the styling of the electric car is something that separates it form the everyday car. And most people choose these unique looking cars over "normal" hybrids and EVs like a Camry hybrid or a Focus electric.
And I know many more people that don't like the styling of either exterior or interior short of their roadster.

The early adopters flocked to the Prius with its "look at me" styling, and those early adopters have now moved on to Tesla cars. Toyota is coming out with the Corolla hybrid in the US and Canada, a new RAV4 hybrid, and a Highlander Hybrid. The prices will be attractive on all these models. It remains to be seen if the new generation RAV4 hybrid will continue to eat Prius sales, but Toyota's strategy of bringing in "normal" hybrids to attract mainstream buyers to their hybrids is working. Most buyers are staying in the showroom, while only the early adopters move on.

There are enough Prius cars on the road with good service records to cement the Toyota hybrid drive's good reliability reputation. Toyota has done their homework and has given both their return and potential customers what the want.
Exactly they are early adopters that want everyone to know they have money and are "better" then everyone else because they drive an electric. They are all over. It is the same reason the original prius did not take off till the second generation when it looked totally different from every other car as compared to the first gen that looked like that Toyota Echo with a slightly different grill that was mostly covered by hood. Most early adopters wanted everyone to know. There is a reason that Hybrid owners when the prius was pretty much the only game, got the rep for being stuck up holier than thou, and many of those people have moved on to Tesla are the same way and are willing to over look quality and stylistic shortcomings because they can be seen for their holier than thou-ness by all around them. where as not most hybrid owners don't drive a prius they are regular Socar Moms and dads or average Joe and drive sedan or CUV and buy it because there is not a high price difference but they get a good chunk better MPG and that's their main interest in it.

Personally if I had the money and was only interested in on-road ability I would go for the I Pace it is a great looking car with a real face for a front end.https://article.images.consumerrepo... Images 2019/Cars/February/CR-Cars-InlineHero-2019-Jaguar-I-Pace-f-driving-2-19

Even the 2019 Leaf has evolved as it seeks to attract new buyers it looks less "electric" and more hot hatch with styling that while it is not a Grill gives the appearance of what would be one thus giving the 2019 a real face and one that is much more "car" like.
https://hips.hearstapps.com/hmg-pro...s/2019-nissan-leaf-plus-111-1546880207.jpg?crop=1xw:1xh;center,top&resize=980:*
https://hips.hearstapps.com/hmg-pro...mazonaws.com/images/2019-nissan-leaf-plus-placement-1546880096.jpg?resize=768:*
 
#24 ·
I can mock Elon Musk because he just stole Fisker's place in line... overpromising constantly and lying about safety and cheeping out on autonomous systems... breaking SEC rules and laughing about it... getting people killed and then saying “they should have read the owner's manual”...

Some innovation but not nearly as much as he gets credit for.
 
#26 ·
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#27 ·
Well... Musk is not ready for prime time, anyway! I always thought there was something wrong about giving people $7,500 off a luxury car.
 
#32 ·
Tesla as a company seems to have a high turnover of executive and engineering personnel. I look at companies where some of them turn up after leaving, and it seems obvious Tesla's success isn't a one man show. Other companies are pushing the leading edge and providing real change. Proterra is one example by their offering their electric bus technology to commercial vehicle manufacturers.
 
#34 ·
Re Tesla — Musk isn’t actually developing those technologies... just bankrolling them... no automaker can ever be a one-man show. I think this is a classic case of the founder outlasting his usefulness; he did a great job as circus barker, but now he's increasingly in the way. If he left, I think Tesla might have a shot at profitability. Then again, perhaps he will be needed more than ever to promise the impossible (like “your camera-only cars will have self-driving, pay now, use later!”) when VW-Audi floods the markets with good electrics... and when BMW finally gets its electric act in gear, so to speak...

BYD is also a potential competitor. I thought Nio (might have the name wrong) was, too, but they're having some financial issues now. Not everyone can play the “lose money for ten years” game.

The EU’s elimination of diesel pollution games means more electric cars going mainstream. Tesla does have the most experience, as a company, but that experience, as people, keeps walking out the door.

One thing is for sure: they’d better figure out ways to reduce reliance on lithium... .
 
#35 ·
One thing is for sure: they’d better figure out ways to reduce reliance on lithium... .
It's not just lithium.

According to a report I was reading online the other night, at the rate EV production is likely to take in the short / medium term....then NICKEL is also going to become a problem regarding supply on Earth.

The industry would do well to step up research on more common / less expensive elements and materials...fast.
 
#39 ·
#40 ·
Lithium is one of the most abundant elements (as you'd expect from its low atomic number); Cobalt is the big problem with LiCo batteries. There are so many "next big things" in battery tech that end up coming to nothing. (I believe we have a poster here who works in this industry, actually, but I can't remember who it is... sorry)

The turn away from diesel in the EU won't help Tesla long-term. Their products are class-leading now, but they're too American for European tastes (we've never really liked sedans), and in a European context, Tesla's biggest advantage of longer range between charges just isn't that big a deal. The difference between 300km or 500km of range isn't a deal-breaker in a continent with the density of settlements that Europe has. It's really, really hard to drive 100km (60 miles) wthout passing a town big enough to support a service station.

I'd guess that Tesla is about 18 months ahead of the competition now. Its problem is that last year, I guessed they were over 2 years ahead. That gap is closing, especially in Europe where the likes of VW, PSA and even FCA can bring the kind of economies of scale to EVs that Tesla can only dream of.. My opinion has always been that Musk blew Tesla's future by pursuing an egotistical dream of being a car-maker; it could now be the world's leading supplier of EV drivetrains and battery tech if only he'd concentrated on where their expertise is. Right now, they make shonky cars with great electric powertrains.

Toyota may end up trailing the pack - its class-leading hybrids have given it a solid lead in its main markets of Japan and USA (diesel was never a competing technology in either), but it's behind the curve on PHEV and EVs. Unless Japan starts to shift towards EVs, Toyota will end up not being able to spend enough to develop the technology - it's a still very much a bit-player in Europe.
 
#42 ·
I do object to the statement “This is no different than what Apple did to their older iPhones in the throttling and performance case.” Apple throttled performance to increase battery life, not hurt it. Then they quickly gave users more information and options when it turned out not everyone liked their decision; and they agreed to replace batteries at a low price for, I think, a full year. What Tesla seems to have done is realized that their cost-cutting and short-cutting was causing publicity blowback, and changed the battery profile to be safer, hurting performance—without compensating anyone. And, of course, you can still give them thousands of dollars to unlock part of your battery — tell me how environmentally friendly that policy is, again?